I see you adhere to the typical leftist pattern of providing distraction and obfuscation by choosing in your invariably snotty, smart-Alecky fashion to emphasize irrelevancies while glossing over important points wore thin long ago. Most of us are wise to your tiresome games, and refuse to let you get away with it any longer.
Either argue the case on its merits or get the hell out of the discussion. No one needs crap artists like you befouling the atmosphere with your counterfeit concerns and hypocritical pretension to moral and intellectual superiority.
Of course the S.O.B. understands, but his "mission" is to obfuscate, distract and dissipate honest discussion of genuine issues, because he and all his perverse, hopelessly warped, indoctrinated kind cannot argue the merits of their point of view, because it has no merit whatsoever.
They want to "win" anyway, of course because all they really want is the power to push everyone else around. Their aggressive pretense of moral superiority makes them doubly despicable.
Dervish Sanders, aka Whirling Dervish, aka Derv the Swerve, okay the last is my name for him, is one strange dude. Seems since he set up his "Lying Lester's Irrational Nation" parody blog he has abandoned his other blog Sleeping with The Devil. Just ignore wd/DS, the more you feed him the more he'll come back for more.
Perhaps the way the ACA was alledgedly steered through congress is reason for concern. However I'm relatively certain it wasn't much different that the norm.
The real outrage should be directed at why as the wealthiest and most powerful nation on earth we ARE NOT THE HEALTHIEST and HAPPIEST nation on earth.
We can spend billions upon billions on war and the MIC yet our healthcare system was failing us. Instead of thinking outside the box and working to acheive a better solution than the ACA and arrive at a bipartisan consensus consevatives and republicans dug their heels in and became obstructionists.
My friend Les Carpenter is correct about our health care system being broken and about the ACA not being an ideal solution. The Republicans could have worked with the Democrats and actually contributed to shaping the legislation. Instead they obstruct and waste time and money on pointless repeal votes. Hopefully there will be a political price for them to pay.
Yes and with a reported 20,000 pages of regulations all of the $#!t that we've seen so far has been only, the proverbial, 'tip of the iceberg'. Perhaps the AFFORDABLE CARE ACT (ACA) will become known as the ATTORNEY'S COMPANION ACT (ACA)!
Does that mean you failed to grasp the real "outrage"?
No, I get it. This legislation means that people who previously did not have health insurance now do, and as a consequence lives will be saved and the Democrats will receive credit. Both of these results anger Conservatives.
Kid, I am no flaming liberal but not everything liberals are saying is wrong. Further, as the avowed patriot that you are I'm sure you've read Thomas Paine. If not you might want to, and more than just Common Sense.
BTW, just curious, if liberals are libtards what would that make our liberal founders? Oh, and one more question, if liberals are libtards does that mean conservatives constipatives
Rational. The problem is that the democrat media have so obfuscated the terms Conservative and Liberal as to make them about useless in modern conversation.
I agree that True Conservatives are Maximum Social Liberals. As were our Founders. I also maintain that most republicans are not conservatives. They want to control other people too much. (This doesn't make me a libertarian. It makes me a True Conservative for anyone else reading)
Still - we need to be able to communicate. Today's 'liberals" ARE libtards. They contradict themselves within single sentences. Their middle name is ultra-hypocrisy and nothing they say can be backed up by facts or even posited as a reasonable theory. They ARE retarded. Their mental development has been retarded. I know 5 year olds who are smarter than most of the libtards we see posting over and over on website comment sections.
How's that grab ya. We can talk some more about it if you want.
As long as libtards and wingnuts or lunatics and troglodytes et all remain part of the vocabulary there will be no communication. It will be by design.
One can either be part of the discussion or part of the problem. A choice everyone has.
Libtards. These are the people who infest the comment sections of articles and blogs and refuse to even consider anyone else's point of view. These are the people I'm talking about. Respect them? Not even with a gun to my head. they are enemies of the USA. Toss in All of the democrat politicians and many of the repubs.
See what I'm saying? These aren't people who disagree. These are people who lie, cheat, steal, photoshop, edit audio clips and propagandize the population. They include the media, the democrat politicians, some of the repubs and a whole bunch of people squealing away like 3 year old calling me a racist (I'm not) a domestic terrorist (I'm not) and worse.
They are people so stupid they buy into climate change and obamacare. Respect them? Nope. Isn't obvious they have no respect for anyone else.?
I'm not talking about some 25 year old who hasn't had an ounce of education and is out there trying to figure things out.
Let's keep it simple. Dems have done all the major damage to this country. If a person is over 35 and votes democrat they are a libtard at best. More likely a communist or in it for their own personal gain. I consider them enemies and will treat them as such.
I've played this game of listening to them and offering up my experience and decades of knowledge. Over 2 decades at it not a single libtard has ever considered a single sentence. They're like zombies, they're back the next day with the same infantile BS.
Well Kid, little point in beating a already dead horse. I'll leave you with a final thought, when a person any, person, thinks they can't learn something from everyone or that they know everything they are sadly mistaken.
Rational. I learn stuff every day. I'll change my opinion and have on a dime based on valid input. I'm still interested in which direction you think we should be going. Or are you going to crap out on that?
Someone placed the following remark under "Jenna's" post before. fortunately i saved it, because this person is most aptly described in this remark.
"And because conservatives have to rely too much on mindless, moronic ideologues like you to represent them.
"Jenna" s a troll who posted several imbecilic, irrelevant, totally inappropriate remarks at my blog earlier. "A. Jacks," whoever he is, was dead on target.
FT, FYI...There may be more than one "Jenna" circulating about today. I say that because some of the Jenna comments at more than one blog site today don't correlate with other Jenna comments.
Liberalmann, Surely you jest when you say Again...really...what "lies?"
The lie about keeping one's doctor is one example of a lie told.
An example of another lie is that those of us with policies would be able to keep our policies if we liked them. Millions of policyholders were not able to do so -- and Obama actually has admitted that fact.
Aw really! That's so cheesy. Several years ago, I switched from one provider to another and had to switch doctors. Big Deal.
And you really want those who have crappy plans which don't even cover emergency room visits to keep their plans so you and me, the tax payers have to pick up the tab? That's the whole point of the ACA.
Liberalmann, If you were under the care of a neurologist or a neurosurgeon, you wouldn't say such an asinine thing.
The same goes for an ophthalmic surgeon and a retinal surgeon.
Not all medical experts are of high quality. Disbelieve that at your own peril -- the peril of losing your sight (my case) or your life (Mr. AOW's case).
The Jenna comment here on April 23, 2014 at 7:18:00 AM EDT is quite accurate, IMO. Certainly, several lies were told to get the American people to consider even the idea of the ACA.
It seems to me that passing a bill into law without first reading that bill is political malpractice -- no matter which political parties follow that kind of "procedure."
Devilish Sanders is looking to get some traffic to his blog, because he needs it badly. No one in their right mind bothers to go there , except got laughs
I do not need traffic "badly". Traffic to my blog is low and has on average always been low. It likely always will be. After so many years (that my blog has been in existence) I accept it. If, like "Four Seasons" (who is likely Rational Nation), you want to look at my blog to "got laughs", then go ahead. I won't "got sads" if you do. Nor will I got sads if you don't look.
BTW, I disagree about these "lies" regarding keeping policies and keeping doctors. These things happened due to insurance company actions, not anything in the ACA. Also, President Obama never "admitted" lying, only that the administration did not point out that some insurers might significantly change some plans such that they could not be grandfathered. Obviously some people want to blame the ACA for problems the health insurance companies are responsible for... much like there are some who wish to blame the Democrats for Republicans refusing to work with them.
Rational, so break it down for me. I'm a studied individual in the human condition here in our lovely USA. Last election we had: 97% black voting for obama. Add in a large majority gay and other 'minority' voting blocks. There are two main motivating factors for why people vote one way or the other - their wallet, and fear. Think that's wrong? Put up your case.
Wide Majority union members voting obama. I know a bunch of these people. They don't care for obama - think he's wrong direction but they vote for him because they don't want their wallet disturbed (free fill in the blank) This is based on experience and knowledge of what drove people in the last major election. So, you tell me why intelligent, strong, self-accountable, freedom loving people would vote for democrats. And back it up.
Agreed, most do vote their wallet, the rest are influenced by fear of the unknown or change.Whether the change may be good or not is of little concern to this type. My I ask which group you fall in. Mind you they are not mutually exclusive.
You explain why struggling families would vote against their perceived self interest. You explain why the Kochs' and other mega wealthy corporations and individuals spend billions to preserved their phenomenal wealth.
Then explain to us why the shrinking middle class and growing under employed should vote for candidates and policies that directly favor the wealthy at the expense of their own interests.
It is not for me to explain. First you must question your own paradigms, then perhaps we could have a discussion between two fiscal conservatives and at least one social libertarian.
Struggling families? Well, let me be specific. My coworkers brother is middle management Ford assembly line. He doesn't agree with any of obama's agendas but he votes for democrats to keep a highly compensative job with great benefits. There are many in this situation.
I concede it is hard to vote against one's self interest. But dang, this guy I'm talking about has parents who are multi-millionaires and democrat tax policies will take at least 50% of that wealth in death taxes, so is he really voting his self interest?
I didn't mention the Koch bros, but I did read in an article today that 'they sometimes vote in opposition to their self interest' in the direction of what is right in a free society. True? I don't know.
If I read you right, you seem to have it in for "the rich". Well, there are at least a couple kinds of rich. Wall street people who suck money out of the system and return nothing. I have no use for those folks and would agree they are part of the problem. Then you have business owners who generally speaking bring better products and competitive prices into our lives. Look around you house. How many things do you value that came from the federal government versus what came from private industry. Many of those industries are public companies you can invest in and share profits while we're talking here... My house/life? Nothing comes from the feds. It all comes from private industry(house, car, furniture, TV, entertainment, PC, internet, clothes, food, health care(soon to be gone) The only thing the federal government is supposed to provide that I find value in is National Defense and they're not doing much of a job of that these days. The middle class is being destroyed by the federal government, mainly the democrats by introducing programs and be republicans for not over turning a one of them since LBJ started the big flush in 1963-64. Added on by carter, then clinton, bush (dhs/tsa) and now obama. Today's current democrat policies are destroying the middle class. Did I read you right? lemme know, we'll continue later. Late here.
Oh, the group I fall into? Constitutional Conservative. I will vote to preserve this country's founding principles even if it hurts me personally in my wallet. Absolutely.
There are several proofs in the above article. We also read this in the article:
Obamacare is going to mean higher taxes and much higher health insurance premiums for middle class Americans. Not only that, but millions of hard working Americans are going to end up losing their jobs or having their hours cut back thanks to Obamacare.
On April 22, 2014, the NYT published this article: The American Middle Class Is No Longer the World’s Richest. Of course, the article has a clear bias -- particularly with regard to possible solutions. Nevertheless, there are facts which cannot be denied.
Meanwhile, on the local level, taxes and other fees (water, sewer, etc.) for property owners are soaring to the moon.
The bell tolls. Some of us can hear the bell loud and clear. Others refuse to hear -- and to believe their eyes. The human capacity for ignoring reality is infinite!
Well Kid, ya read me wrong. I have great respect for the value of money and when properly accumulated and productively used it has great capacity for good.
As an executive manager in a very good company I experienced it first hand. The corrupting power of money just seems to affect the majority of corporations.
Oh, then there is crony capitalism and corporatism.
Yes the bell is tolling. Better figure out a real solution before it is too late.
Nothing -- with or without ObamaCare -- prevents such a situation.
People have the mistaken idea that health insurance will prevent medical bankruptcy.
People also have the mistaken idea that Medicare benefits are free. THEY ARE NOT! Mr. AOW has Medicare coverage, and still our medical expenses for 2013 exceeded $40,000 (premiums for the two of us, my eye surgery and the subsequent caregiver for 10 days), medical equipment including a handicapped van, medications, paratransit fees, etc.).
"BTW, I disagree about these "lies" regarding keeping policies and keeping doctors. These things happened due to insurance company actions, not anything in the ACA."
WOW, what a COINCIDENCE! Millions just happened to lose Dr., insurance, etc. at the passage of the ACA but these events had [nothing to do] with the ACA. It's no wonder that no one visits your blog site; what would be the point?
I never said it was a coincidence. That's your word. Used to make me look dumb. The ACA contained a provision that said substandard plans could be grandfathered in IF the insurers did not significantly changed them. THE INSURANCE COMPANIES changed the plans and THEY made them ineligible for grandfathering. They were substandard plans that did not minimum standards of coverage anyway, so I don't believe they should have even been eligible for grandfathering (the type of plan described in the article AOW links to in his comment above). These plans SHOULD be gotten rid of.
I don't want anyone deciding for me what a substandard plan is.
I, the consumer, should make that decision for myself.
The "substandard" plan that Mr. AOW had when he had his devastating stroke served us well -- with a premium of $700/month. A "standard" plan at that time was well over $1200/month -- a rate that was well out of our range of affordability.
Also, for your information, many of the plans that are now deemed "standard" have higher deductibles than the "substandard" plans.
Oh, and one more thing....At the age of 62, I certainly do not need or want a health insurance plan that covers birth control. I resent that my plan covers the "cost" of unnecessary birth control for me.
PERHAPS THE BIGGEST FLAW WITH THE FUNDING ISSUE OF THE ACA: that children can stay on their parents' health insurance plans until those children are 26 years old. An understanding of how insurance works tells us that insurance plans need the low-risk and healthy young on board.
Just amazing how those on the right are so willing to buy the lies designed get them to believe crap and vote against their own best interests. Lives have already been saved with ACA. Millions more are now covered. It's here to stay.
When all is said and done Washington just gained control over another one sixth of our economy. They completely broke what they controlled before. Hang on Boys and Girls ... oh and Ducks too.
We welcome civil dialogue at Always on Watch. Comments that include any of the following are subject to deletion: 1. Any use of profanity or abusive language 2. Off topic comments and spam 3. Use of personal invective
Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.
Deem and pass!
ReplyDeleteA Jacks said
DeleteDoes the Constitution really allow for that, or is it just another thuggish maneuver by the ever more lawless Disastercrats?
"The Patriot Post: Voice of Essential Liberty" needs more spell checkers. "Thy carved out exemptions for their cronies"? The missing "e" outrages me.
ReplyDeleteWritten by an escaped lunatic from the funny farm.
DeleteA. Jacks said
DeleteI see you adhere to the typical leftist pattern of providing distraction and obfuscation by choosing in your invariably snotty, smart-Alecky fashion to emphasize irrelevancies while glossing over important points wore thin long ago. Most of us are wise to your tiresome games, and refuse to let you get away with it any longer.
Either argue the case on its merits or get the hell out of the discussion. No one needs crap artists like you befouling the atmosphere with your counterfeit concerns and hypocritical pretension to moral and intellectual superiority.
" The missing "e" outrages me."
ReplyDeleteWho cares about a missing "e"? Does that mean you failed to grasp the real "outrage"?
A. Jacks said
DeleteOf course the S.O.B. understands, but his "mission" is to obfuscate, distract and dissipate honest discussion of genuine issues, because he and all his perverse, hopelessly warped, indoctrinated kind cannot argue the merits of their point of view, because it has no merit whatsoever.
They want to "win" anyway, of course because all they really want is the power to push everyone else around. Their aggressive pretense of moral superiority makes them doubly despicable.
I second that very astute observation !
DeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteDervish Sanders', apparent, lack of any sort of depth speaks volumes about the Left and the road to Hell that they would have the rest of us travel.
ReplyDeleteDervish Sanders, aka Whirling Dervish, aka Derv the Swerve, okay the last is my name for him, is one strange dude. Seems since he set up his "Lying Lester's Irrational Nation" parody blog he has abandoned his other blog Sleeping with The Devil. Just ignore wd/DS, the more you feed him the more he'll come back for more.
DeletePerhaps the way the ACA was alledgedly steered through congress is reason for concern. However I'm relatively certain it wasn't much different that the norm.
The real outrage should be directed at why as the wealthiest and most powerful nation on earth we ARE NOT THE HEALTHIEST and HAPPIEST nation on earth.
We can spend billions upon billions on war and the MIC yet our healthcare system was failing us. Instead of thinking
outside the box and working to acheive a better solution than the ACA and arrive at a bipartisan consensus consevatives and republicans dug their heels in and became obstructionists.
There is a better, more American way.
My friend Les Carpenter is correct about our health care system being broken and about the ACA not being an ideal solution. The Republicans could have worked with the Democrats and actually contributed to shaping the legislation. Instead they obstruct and waste time and money on pointless repeal votes. Hopefully there will be a political price for them to pay.
Delete"IT'S 2000 PAGES LONG AND NO ONE READS IT"
ReplyDeleteYes and with a reported 20,000 pages of regulations all of the $#!t that we've seen so far has been only, the proverbial, 'tip of the iceberg'. Perhaps the AFFORDABLE CARE ACT (ACA) will become known as the ATTORNEY'S COMPANION ACT (ACA)!
We'll find out in November if there is any outrage.
ReplyDeleteYes, we will.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteDoes that mean you failed to grasp the real "outrage"?
ReplyDeleteNo, I get it. This legislation means that people who previously did not have health insurance now do, and as a consequence lives will be saved and the Democrats will receive credit. Both of these results anger Conservatives.
And some of us who already had private policies are now either paying more for those policies or have decreased coverage.
DeleteI no longer put the slightest effort into educating libtards. Let them hit the wall at 100 mph. I'll get a good laugh out of that.
DeleteKid, I am no flaming liberal but not everything liberals are saying is wrong. Further, as the avowed patriot that you are I'm sure you've read Thomas Paine. If not you might want to, and more than just Common Sense.
DeleteBTW, just curious, if liberals are libtards what would that make our liberal founders? Oh,
and one more question, if liberals are libtards
does that mean conservatives constipatives
Rational. The problem is that the democrat media have so obfuscated the terms Conservative and Liberal as to make them about useless in modern conversation.
DeleteI agree that True Conservatives are Maximum Social Liberals. As were our Founders. I also maintain that most republicans are not conservatives. They want to control other people too much. (This doesn't make me a libertarian. It makes me a True Conservative for anyone else reading)
Still - we need to be able to communicate. Today's 'liberals" ARE libtards. They contradict themselves within single sentences. Their middle name is ultra-hypocrisy and nothing they say can be backed up by facts or even posited as a reasonable theory. They ARE retarded. Their mental development has been retarded. I know 5 year olds who are smarter than most of the libtards we see posting over and over on website comment sections.
How's that grab ya. We can talk some more about it if you want.
PS, As always, nothing is 100% inclusive.
DeleteWell of course nothing is 100% inclusive.
DeleteAs long as libtards and wingnuts or lunatics and troglodytes et all remain part of the vocabulary there will be no communication. It will be by design.
One can either be part of the discussion or part of the problem. A choice everyone has.
Apparently you have made yours.
Rational, You didn't say anything here. I put my best foot forward and now it is time for You to be part of the conversation. I'll meet ya half way.
DeletePick a subject.
The value of treating people you disagree with with respect.
DeleteWhat value is to be gained by referring to intelligent individuals as Libtards or Libturds just because you dislike their views?
What do you fear? Is not the power of your viewpoint capable of "winning the debate" absent ad hominem personal attacks?
Libtards. These are the people who infest the comment sections of articles and blogs and refuse to even consider anyone else's point of view. These are the people I'm talking about. Respect them? Not even with a gun to my head. they are enemies of the USA. Toss in All of the democrat politicians and many of the repubs.
DeleteSee what I'm saying? These aren't people who disagree. These are people who lie, cheat, steal, photoshop, edit audio clips and propagandize the population. They include the media, the democrat politicians, some of the repubs and a whole bunch of people squealing away like 3 year old calling me a racist (I'm not) a domestic terrorist (I'm not) and worse.
They are people so stupid they buy into climate change and obamacare. Respect them? Nope. Isn't obvious they have no respect for anyone else.?
I'm not talking about some 25 year old who hasn't had an ounce of education and is out there trying to figure things out.
Let's keep it simple. Dems have done all the major damage to this country. If a person is over 35 and votes democrat they are a libtard at best. More likely a communist or in it for their own personal gain. I consider them enemies and will treat them as such.
I've played this game of listening to them and offering up my experience and decades of knowledge. Over 2 decades at it not a single libtard has ever considered a single sentence. They're like zombies, they're back the next day with the same infantile BS.
Libtard is actually going easy on them.
Well Kid, little point in beating a already dead horse. I'll leave you with a final thought, when a person any, person, thinks they can't learn something from everyone or that they know everything they are sadly mistaken.
DeleteRational. I learn stuff every day. I'll change my opinion and have on a dime based on valid input.
DeleteI'm still interested in which direction you think we should be going. Or are you going to crap out on that?
Someone placed the following remark under "Jenna's" post before. fortunately i saved it, because this person is most aptly described in this remark.
ReplyDelete"And because conservatives have to rely too much on mindless, moronic ideologues like you to represent them.
"Jenna" s a troll who posted several imbecilic, irrelevant, totally inappropriate remarks at my blog earlier. "A. Jacks," whoever he is, was dead on target.
FT,
ReplyDeleteFYI...There may be more than one "Jenna" circulating about today. I say that because some of the Jenna comments at more than one blog site today don't correlate with other Jenna comments.
Again...really...what "lies?" Did you delete my first post becasue you don't have any examples? It's a simple question.
ReplyDeleteLiberalmann,
DeleteI deleted your post because you used foul language. Please review the comment guidelines there at this blog.
Liberalmann,
DeleteSurely you jest when you say Again...really...what "lies?"
The lie about keeping one's doctor is one example of a lie told.
An example of another lie is that those of us with policies would be able to keep our policies if we liked them. Millions of policyholders were not able to do so -- and Obama actually has admitted that fact.
Aw really! That's so cheesy. Several years ago, I switched from one provider to another and had to switch doctors. Big Deal.
DeleteAnd you really want those who have crappy plans which don't even cover emergency room visits to keep their plans so you and me, the tax payers have to pick up the tab? That's the whole point of the ACA.
Weak, very weak.
Liberalmann,
DeleteIf you were under the care of a neurologist or a neurosurgeon, you wouldn't say such an asinine thing.
The same goes for an ophthalmic surgeon and a retinal surgeon.
Not all medical experts are of high quality. Disbelieve that at your own peril -- the peril of losing your sight (my case) or your life (Mr. AOW's case).
FT,
ReplyDeleteAddendum:
The Jenna comment here on April 23, 2014 at 7:18:00 AM EDT is quite accurate, IMO. Certainly, several lies were told to get the American people to consider even the idea of the ACA.
I did see the spelling error in the graphic.
ReplyDeleteCreative spelling! **snerk**
Apparently, proofreading is a dying art. **sigh**
It seems to me that passing a bill into law without first reading that bill is political malpractice -- no matter which political parties follow that kind of "procedure."
ReplyDeleteDevilish Sanders is looking to get some traffic to his blog, because he needs it badly.
ReplyDeleteNo one in their right mind bothers to go there , except got laughs
I do not need traffic "badly". Traffic to my blog is low and has on average always been low. It likely always will be. After so many years (that my blog has been in existence) I accept it. If, like "Four Seasons" (who is likely Rational Nation), you want to look at my blog to "got laughs", then go ahead. I won't "got sads" if you do. Nor will I got sads if you don't look.
DeleteBTW, I disagree about these "lies" regarding keeping policies and keeping doctors. These things happened due to insurance company actions, not anything in the ACA. Also, President Obama never "admitted" lying, only that the administration did not point out that some insurers might significantly change some plans such that they could not be grandfathered. Obviously some people want to blame the ACA for problems the health insurance companies are responsible for... much like there are some who wish to blame the Democrats for Republicans refusing to work with them.
Many are stupid. Many more aren't willing to hold anyone accountable becaiuse they are weak and unwilling to give up their free (fill in the blank)
ReplyDelete"... becaiuse (sic) they are weak and unwilling to give up their free (fill in the blank
DeleteDo you ever say anything that isn't boilerplate gross generalizations Kid?
Rational, so break it down for me. I'm a studied individual in the human condition here in our lovely USA. Last election we had:
Delete97% black voting for obama. Add in a large majority gay and other 'minority' voting blocks. There are two main motivating factors for why people vote one way or the other - their wallet, and fear.
Think that's wrong? Put up your case.
Wide Majority union members voting obama. I know a bunch of these people. They don't care for obama - think he's wrong direction but they vote for him because they don't want their wallet disturbed (free fill in the blank)
This is based on experience and knowledge of what drove people in the last major election. So, you tell me why intelligent, strong, self-accountable, freedom loving people would vote for democrats.
And back it up.
Agreed, most do vote their wallet, the rest are influenced by fear of the unknown or change.Whether the change may be good or not is of little concern to this type. My I ask which group you fall in. Mind you they are not mutually exclusive.
DeleteYou explain why struggling families would vote against their perceived self interest. You explain why the Kochs' and other mega wealthy corporations and individuals spend billions to preserved their phenomenal wealth.
Then explain to us why the shrinking middle class and growing under employed should vote for candidates and policies that directly favor the wealthy at the expense of their own interests.
It is not for me to explain. First you must question your own paradigms, then perhaps we could have a discussion between two fiscal conservatives and at least one social libertarian.
Paragraph 1. Agreed.
DeleteStruggling families? Well, let me be specific. My coworkers brother is middle management Ford assembly line. He doesn't agree with any of obama's agendas but he votes for democrats to keep a highly compensative job with great benefits. There are many in this situation.
I concede it is hard to vote against one's self interest. But dang, this guy I'm talking about has parents who are multi-millionaires and democrat tax policies will take at least 50% of that wealth in death taxes, so is he really voting his self interest?
I didn't mention the Koch bros, but I did read in an article today that 'they sometimes vote in opposition to their self interest' in the direction of what is right in a free society. True? I don't know.
If I read you right, you seem to have it in for "the rich". Well, there are at least a couple kinds of rich. Wall street people who suck money out of the system and return nothing. I have no use for those folks and would agree they are part of the problem.
Then you have business owners who generally speaking bring better products and competitive prices into our lives. Look around you house. How many things do you value that came from the federal government versus what came from private industry. Many of those industries are public companies you can invest in and share profits while we're talking here...
My house/life? Nothing comes from the feds. It all comes from private industry(house, car, furniture, TV, entertainment, PC, internet, clothes, food, health care(soon to be gone) The only thing the federal government is supposed to provide that I find value in is National Defense and they're not doing much of a job of that these days.
The middle class is being destroyed by the federal government, mainly the democrats by introducing programs and be republicans for not over turning a one of them since LBJ started the big flush in 1963-64. Added on by carter, then clinton, bush (dhs/tsa) and now obama. Today's current democrat policies are destroying the middle class.
Did I read you right? lemme know, we'll continue later. Late here.
Oh, the group I fall into? Constitutional Conservative. I will vote to preserve this country's founding principles even if it hurts me personally in my wallet. Absolutely.
DeleteKid,
DeleteThe middle class is headed for extinction.
There are several proofs in the above article. We also read this in the article:
Obamacare is going to mean higher taxes and much higher health insurance premiums for middle class Americans.
Not only that, but millions of hard working Americans are going to end up losing their jobs or having their hours cut back thanks to Obamacare.
On April 22, 2014, the NYT published this article: The American Middle Class Is No Longer the World’s Richest. Of course, the article has a clear bias -- particularly with regard to possible solutions. Nevertheless, there are facts which cannot be denied.
Meanwhile, on the local level, taxes and other fees (water, sewer, etc.) for property owners are soaring to the moon.
The bell tolls. Some of us can hear the bell loud and clear. Others refuse to hear -- and to believe their eyes. The human capacity for ignoring reality is infinite!
Well Kid, ya read me wrong. I have great respect for the value of money and when properly accumulated and productively used it has great capacity for
Deletegood.
As an executive manager in a very good company I experienced it first hand. The corrupting power of money just seems to affect the majority of corporations.
Oh, then there is crony capitalism and corporatism.
Yes the bell is tolling. Better figure out a real solution before it is too late.
Tic Toc, Tic Toc, Tic Toc...
Crony capitalism. Ok. It's a problem. perfection is impossible right ?
DeleteSO. Tell me what you suggest. What would you like to see the country doing ?
I, for one, have been critical of health insurance before the ACA came along. Please see this essay: Our Health-Care System And The Nanny State.
ReplyDeleteI've been face-to-face with the dragon.
Nothing -- with or without ObamaCare -- prevents such a situation.
People have the mistaken idea that health insurance will prevent medical bankruptcy.
People also have the mistaken idea that Medicare benefits are free. THEY ARE NOT! Mr. AOW has Medicare coverage, and still our medical expenses for 2013 exceeded $40,000 (premiums for the two of us, my eye surgery and the subsequent caregiver for 10 days), medical equipment including a handicapped van, medications, paratransit fees, etc.).
DS,
ReplyDelete"BTW, I disagree about these "lies" regarding keeping policies and keeping doctors. These things happened due to insurance company actions, not anything in the ACA."
WOW, what a COINCIDENCE! Millions just happened to lose Dr., insurance, etc.
at the passage of the ACA but these events had [nothing to do] with the ACA. It's no wonder that no one visits your blog site; what would be the point?
This appeared on the web today: If you like your health plan, you might lose it. Again.
DeleteI never said it was a coincidence. That's your word. Used to make me look dumb. The ACA contained a provision that said substandard plans could be grandfathered in IF the insurers did not significantly changed them. THE INSURANCE COMPANIES changed the plans and THEY made them ineligible for grandfathering. They were substandard plans that did not minimum standards of coverage anyway, so I don't believe they should have even been eligible for grandfathering (the type of plan described in the article AOW links to in his comment above). These plans SHOULD be gotten rid of.
DeleteDervish,
Deletesubstandard ...SHOULD be gotten rid of.
I don't want anyone deciding for me what a substandard plan is.
I, the consumer, should make that decision for myself.
The "substandard" plan that Mr. AOW had when he had his devastating stroke served us well -- with a premium of $700/month. A "standard" plan at that time was well over $1200/month -- a rate that was well out of our range of affordability.
Also, for your information, many of the plans that are now deemed "standard" have higher deductibles than the "substandard" plans.
Oh, and one more thing....At the age of 62, I certainly do not need or want a health insurance plan that covers birth control. I resent that my plan covers the "cost" of unnecessary birth control for me.
PERHAPS THE BIGGEST FLAW WITH THE FUNDING ISSUE OF THE ACA: that children can stay on their parents' health insurance plans until those children are 26 years old. An understanding of how insurance works tells us that insurance plans need the low-risk and healthy young on board.
Delete"I never said it was a coincidence. That's your word. Used to make me look dumb."
ReplyDeleteOf course, it wasn't a coincidence. Now get back to work on your GED!
BTW, I didn't use the word "coincidence" to make you look 'dumb'; that wouldn't be necessary.
ReplyDeleteJust amazing how those on the right are so willing to buy the lies designed get them to believe crap and vote against their own best interests. Lives have already been saved with ACA. Millions more are now covered. It's here to stay.
ReplyDeleteLiberalmann,
DeleteMillions more are now covered.
Wrong! Millions are covered. Other millions lost coverage -- and are not signing up.
It's here to stay.
Maybe, maybe not.
The funding will be the issue.
Anything will go on -- until it can't go on. Finiteness is real.
"The Republicans could have worked with the Democrats and actually contributed to shaping the legislation."
ReplyDeleteOh sure, working with Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid-PLEEEZZZE!
When all is said and done Washington just gained control over another one sixth of our economy. They completely broke what they controlled before. Hang on Boys and Girls ... oh and Ducks too.
ReplyDelete