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Monday, June 27, 2022

Overreach


Silverfiddle Rant!

"Fool if you think its over, it's just begun..."


How long until Centrist voters turn on Republicans?




This list is repugnant to the constitutional spirit of our republic:

* Unconditional abortion at any stage of development with no consideration of the rights and/or viability of the fetus
* State-sponsored "bounty hunting" those (including physicians) who assist in abortion procurement or in an abortion procedure
* Total ban on abortion, with no exceptions based on rape, incest or health of the mother
* Prosecuting a physician for performing a medically-determined abortion
* Prosecuting people who help others procure an abortion, including buying them a ticket or transporting them out of state
* Prosecuting women for having an abortion
* Prosecuting women for traveling out of state for an abortion
* A state prosecuting residents of other states for abortion-related actions taken in another state
* Prohibiting people from receiving any federally legal medications via US Mail
* Prosecuting a woman for ingesting an abortifacient and causing an abortion in her own home

My objection is rooted not in morality, but in historical western jurisprudence, natural rights and our constitution.  We are a constitutional republic, not a Christian theocracy, and the question of abortion--as it pertains to the state and its citizens--needs to be addressed in the light of historical laws, common law and a balancing of the rights of the mother and child, to include the fact that medical science has pushed back the viability of a fetus to 20-25 weeks.

Safe, Legal, and Rare

Go yahoogle polling on abortion.  A broad spectrum of Americans are willing to accept first trimester abortions as well as third trimester bans, with exceptions for rape, incest and health of the mother.

Such a law would flare up the anger on the fringes, but would represent a consensus that polling suggests the nation could settle into.  Such a law would also look like the laws of most advanced European nations.

If the GOP were smart (and they are not), they would loudly kibosh all speculation about banning birth control, rolling back gay marriage, gay rights and sodomy laws, etc.  Democrats have dramatically seized the high ground on the issue of liberty, just as it looked as if the GOP had firm possession of that champion's trophy.

Legal is not necessarily Moral

I think abortion is morally repugnant, as expressed by first century Christians in the Didache. Other religions, including Judaism, while not cavalier on the issue, do not take such a narrow view.  The law must reflect the will of the people and must not impose narrow religious views on everyone.  Otherwise, it is imperial diktat, and in a democracy, the people will end up ousting the tyrants. 

Forcing over-interpreted mandates on people will only harden hearts and minds, not change them.

If we want to end abortion, we need to change those hearts and minds through scientific reasoning and moral persuasion, and for heaven's sake, can we approach this debate with some humility, charity and compassion? 

122 comments:

  1. I would agree with all you said except for medical abortifacients via US Mail. I really don't don't know the efficacy of abortifacients or the consequences of repeated use or misuse of them on the physical health of a woman. I just think that there needs to be a doctor involved at some point in time. For all I know, they could be the equivalent -health-wise- to mail order fentanayl.
    Mail order, they could be misused by 13 year old girls.
    I have no reason to know.
    As you said "If we want to end abortion, we need to change those hearts and minds through scientific reasoning and moral persuasion, and for heaven's sake, can we approach this debate with some humility, charity and compassion?
    Warren

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    Replies
    1. I do not support the use of such medications. I make that statement purely from a legal and constitutional point of view.

      If the federal government says a medication is legal, how can a state outlaw it?

      Does a state have the legal power to interdict material flowing through the US Postal Service?

      Finally, does any level of government have the power to enter someone's home without probable cause? 4th Amendment? How low do we want to set the 'reasonable suspicion' bar?

      I'm not arguing with you, just giving you a better explanation of what I'm thinking.

      Delete
    2. States and local law enforcement officials can't have consent agreements for reporting suspected 'contraband' with federal postal inspectors like state agencies have agreements with immigration/ ICE officials?

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    3. Once the mail was "delivered" state officials could get a state issued search warrant and conduct a raid, couldn't they?

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    4. In my positive scenario, such medications would not be contraband, they would be legal under federal code.

      As to your second comment, I see your point, but I do not want to live in a state where government would raid someone's home under such circumstances.

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    5. About abortifacients (for what it's worth and with my emphases):

      A medical abortion, also known as medication abortion, occurs when medically-prescribed drugs (medication) are used to bring about an abortion. Medical abortions are an alternative to surgical abortions such as vacuum aspiration or dilation and curettage.[5][needs update] Medical abortions are more common than surgical abortions in most places, including Europe, India, China, and the United States.[6][7]

      Medical abortions are typically performed by administering a two-drug combination: mifepristone followed by misoprostol. When mifepristone is not available, misoprostol alone may be used in some situations.[8]

      Medical abortion is both safe and effective throughout a range of gestational ages, including the second and third trimester.[9] Medical abortion can be administered safely by the patient at home, without assistance, in the first trimester.[10] Starting with the second trimester, it is recommended to take the second drug in a clinic or provider's office.[10]

      Medical abortion should not be confused with emergency contraception, which typically involves drugs (such as such as Levonorgestrel or "Plan B") taken soon after intercourse to prevent a pregnancy from beginning.

      There can be adverse effects, particularly after taking the medication advised as Step 2:

      Symptoms that require immediate medical attention:[60]

      Heavy bleeding (enough blood to soak through four sanitary pads in 2 hours)
      Abdominal pain, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, fever for more than 0024 hours after taking mifepristone
      Fever of 38 °C (100.4 °F) or higher for more than 4 hours


      I strongly agree with Warren:

      " there needs to be a doctor involved at some point in time."

      I have no experience with,0 nor do I know any women using abortifacients.

      Delete
    6. Even under the best of circumstances, it's not pretty. I'll leave it at that.

      Delete
  2. The American constitution is exceptionally good at giving the power of veto to minorities. This is often desirable, but it does make it harder to steer the moderate course such as you outline here, even when that solution enjoys a broad consensus. That said, it's not all the constitution's fault, as I think this problem has worsened over recent decades.

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    Replies
    1. There is no 'minority' here. Like many things nowadays, it is virtually a 50/50 issue.

      Delete
    2. Silver commented... "There is no 'minority' here. Like many things nowadays, it is virtually a 50/50 issue."

      Silver, that's not true of the public writ large. The people who vote, potentially, but there is broad public support, whether anyone likes it or agrees with legal abortion up to 15/16 weeks, limiting access to guns for some, the ACA and many other positions staked out by the Dems and historically opposed by the GOP.

      Unless of course all polling, including that of FOX and other right leaning news corporations is wrong.

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    3. Silver... and sorry I missed commenting on your last post. I'm working these two weeks in Southern Mexico without a lot of access to the net.

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    4. Dave, you and Jez we'll have to work harder to prove your case for a tyranny of the minority. These are contentious issues precisely because we are fairly evenly divided on it, depending on which way you slice and dice it or which aspect you focus on

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    5. I think the extremists (at either end) are minorities.

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    6. ...although the distribution does skew Left...

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  3. I agree with Silverfiddle. We need to acknowledge that young people sometimes do stupid silly things and often over-correct by doing even more stupid silly things. If we are talking about applying compassion to the unborn, then we should at least ask, “What kind of compassion forces a newborn into a ‘family’ that doesn’t want it?” My heart goes out to stupid silly young people who are trying to right the ship, and to the infant who in our false righteousness we force to grow up in an angry, resentful, neglectful environment.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Mustang,
      “What kind of compassion forces a newborn into a ‘family’ that doesn’t want it?”

      I know several foolish stupid silly teenagers of childbearing age who carried their pregnancies to term, then gave up their babies for adoption.

      It is my understanding that there are a few million American couples waiting in line to adopt babies, and these couples would very likely see that their children would grow up in an excellent home environment.

      I strongly agree with you that we must certainly strive to avoid false righteousness!

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    2. It is my understanding that there are a few million American couples waiting in line to adopt babies...

      Why are there so many kids languishing in the Foster system then?

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    3. @CI
      Because they are not infants.
      It's expensive and time consuming to adopt.
      Many children in Foster care are special needs or have emotional problems.
      Many of the children in Foster care are not adoptable because their parents refuse to give up their parental rights and are therefor unadoptable.....
      Warren

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    4. That is is so sad Warren. It amazes me we talk about the value of life but at the same time devalue the lives of those intellectually or physically disabled - because they are not perfect. If these pro-abortions are perfect God help us. How would they feel if they knew their mom's really wanted an abortion but were forced to have them? Do they even think about any of that?

      Delete
    5. Mustang wrote, "My heart goes out to stupid silly young people who are trying to right the ship, and to the infant who in our false righteousness we force to grow up in an angry, resentful, neglectful environment."

      That is true of most of us. We are all silly when we are young and sometimes stupid. Yes, we feel awful for infants growing up in a bad environment, but not all do. Sadly this is the pligth of life. There is never a win - win situation. But I would never call it false righteousness. Only God knows the heart of these people and every one of us fall short of the glory of God.

      BTW, is that comment a cut and paste from Z's post on abortion. Clever!

      Delete
  4. Otherwise, it is imperial diktat, and in a democracy, the people will end up ousting the tyrants.

    Madison claimed that the worst tyranny was "the majority" (Memorial and Remonstrance)... "True it is, that no other rule exists, by which any question which may divide a Society, can be ultimately determined, but the will of the majority; but it is also true that the majority may trespass on the rights of the minority."

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The majority can't be "ousted"... hence we have trial by jury and jury nullification by 1 of 12 in a jury of "peers". If the law over-reaches, there is a remedy that dare not speak its' name. Nullification.

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    2. So the fact that the law may be too "restrictive" is made moot by Jez's "veto by the minority". Just get 12 women in the jury box. I'm sure that a "minority opinion" exists there... provided you can find one with the "courage" to exercise it.

      Delete
  5. SF,
    Excellent, excellent post, my friend!

    I have a lot to say in response, but let me start here....

    medical science has pushed back the viability of a fetus to 20-25 weeks

    At what cost is that viability? And I'm not referring only to dollars, although that aspect matters, too, on a practical level.

    Some years ago, one of my friends had a baby at 23 weeks. The medical issues for that boy were -- and still are -- horrible.

    Most of these costs have been paid for -- and continue to be paid for -- by us the taxpayers because this is a military family.

    To name two problems that have continued, and this man must be at least 30 years old by now:

    1) Physical issues with swallowing. Major issues.

    2) Severe learning disabilities.

    If not for the deep pockets of the grandparents, the parents would be "living under the bridge."

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No doubt. One of the many reasons this debate has been so unhinged, is that neither side will acknowledge the balance of rights, which has always been recognized throughout history. I bring this up, because medical advances do change the landscape of this debate. do change the landscape of this debate.

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    2. I agree medicine has advanced but disagree that it's a game changer of the debate.

      I grew up in a Democratic Catholic community and went to a Catholic school. I well recall the 1973 decision as a child and the reaction of the nuns who taught us.

      It ain't about medicine or birthrates.

      I saw the church turning on Democrats around a decade ago and started turning the pulpit into a campaign stump for Republicans. I know the swing from Ds to Rs in this community was largely due to abortions.

      Looks to me that the Repugs have gotten themselves into a pickle.

      "Change those hearts and minds through scientific reasoning and moral persuasion"? Seriously? After spending years of ignoring, demeaning, rejecting, and denying science, I'd say you can take a Sharpie to that one.

      "If the GOP were smart (and they are not), they would loudly kibosh all speculation about banning birth control, rolling back gay marriage, gay rights and sodomy laws, etc."

      It isn't a matter of smarts but rather a corner that they've allowed Trumpism to paint them into. You may not agree but the truth is that there is a very racist, homophobic, and ugly faction of voters who've shifted far right. And this faction has taken on a renewed growth and now enjoy a wealthy network. Their only choice is to tiptoe around and let the Supremes do the dirty work. How many of these guys chastised "an historic victory for white lives" comment? They can't.

      Now that the lid's been blown off the can, there is and will be lively discussions and in my opinion, it's going to be a factor at the voting booth.

      Going forward, it will be interesting to see how pro-life the ReThugs really are. Here's one. How about allowing parents to claim an unborn child as a dependent? After all, it's a human life. Considering they haven't done a damn thing in 50 years to address the problem, can we expect a change?. In the meantime, Dems gave us The Adoption and Safe Family Act, The Family Medical Leave Act, The Born Alive Infants Protection Act, ACA, and more- cutting abortion rates in half over the last 50 years.

      So now that all eyes are on these discussions and debates, let's see what the Party of Trump will do. Or, what their rancid faction will allow them to do.

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    3. Ronald, this is just the response I expected from you. Charitable debate is wasted on political team sport ideologues like you.

      BTW, Catholics are pretty much evenly split between Democrats and Republicans.

      Delete
    4. lol! Ronnie credits Dems with the lowered abortion stats... not State laws paring the practice back.

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    5. FJ, a 2021 study by the American Journal of Public Health says maternal mortality was higher in states that were more abortion restrictive.

      I suppose as red states make it illegal and women go to blue states, those numbers proves it works? I mean, never mind red state dumpsters collecting more newborns from the desolate.

      Delete
    6. Its been my experience, dealing with many RC Parishes and congregations; most Catholics are Democrats, even in rural Parishes. Conservatives are under represented but tend to hold positions in practical matters such as financial matters, school administration and resource allocation. But the Parish Priest always has final say in all matters except for the imprimatur of the diocese Bishop or Cardinal whom only answers to the Pope. Older Priests tend to be Conservative and younger Liberal. Conservative rural Catholics tend to vote Democrat because of farm subsidies since the time of FDR.
      I backed away from the RC church because of internal matters having to do with with internal politics and administration.
      In short, besides Ronald being a bigot, he doesn't know what he's talking about.

      Warren

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    7. Warren, I can't speak for your experience or your geographical ideologies but I'm quite satisfied I know more about what I'm talking about of the Catholic community I've live in for 64 years than you do.

      I also don't have this unsubstantiated data of conservatives having the more smarter and grown up positions you speak of in Catholic congregations but then, maybe that was some long ago era your conservative groomers told you of? Admittingly, that is something I seriously don't know.

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    8. @RJW,
      I'm sure you believe what you say. Try looking up invincible ignorance.

      Delete
    9. FJ, a 2021 study by the American Journal of Public Health says maternal mortality was higher in states that were more abortion restrictive.

      That's a joke, because the laws we tried to pass in Maryland required abortion clinic doctors to have admitting privileges at local hospitals... and facilities comparable to hospitals, and the pro Choicer's fought against that tooth and nail. They wanted to continue using rusty coat-hangers just like they always had.

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    10. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    11. o call me when you actually have a clue as to what's REALLY happening in the abortion clinics. PS - What's you consider "dangerous" for the mother is "fatal" for her child.

      Example 1

      Example 2

      Example 3

      Example 4

      Example 5

      Example 6

      Example 7

      Example 8

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    12. The more pro-CHOICE a state is, the WORSE it's abortion licensing and safety regulations.

      Delete
    13. FJ, I reject your links as credible mainly because they are unhinged far right, howl-at-the-moon, QAnon Trump sucking, propagandist insurrection supporting, and intellectually insulting garbage.

      If it weren’t for that, maybe there I could actually take you seriously.

      Delete
    14. You reject my links because you're incapable of processing information that strays outside of the heavily myelinated ruts in your brain that you established by exclusively reading Left-wing propaganda for the past 60 years of your life.

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    15. I don’t construe the likes of AmericanNonThinker, Daily Wire, Washington Times and so on as informative information.

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    16. Because they serve up a counter-narrative... and you love to wallow in your own filth... so, we get it.

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    17. Your comfort zone never rises above eye-level with your trough.

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    18. Ronald is representing the mouth breather club quite well today.

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    19. He's never been to Dodona. :(
      \
      ’Tis mute, the word they went to hear on high Dodona mountain
      When winds were in the oakenshaws and all the cauldrons tolled,
      And mute’s the midland navel-stone beside the singing fountain,
      And echoes list to silence now where gods told lies of old.

      I took my question to the shrine that has not ceased from speaking,
      The heart within, that tells the truth and tells it twice as plain;
      And from the cave of oracles I hear the priestess shrieking
      That she and I should surely die and never live again.

      Oh priestess, what you cry is clear, and sound good sense I think it;
      But let the screaming echoes rest, and froth your mouth no more.
      ’Tis true there’s better boose than brine, but he that drowns must drink it;
      And oh, my lass, the news is news that men have heard before.

      The king with half the East at heel is marched from lands of morning;
      Their fighters drink the rivers up, their shafts benight the air.
      And he that stands must die for nought, and home there’s no returning.
      The Spartans on the sea-wet rock sat down and combed their hair.


      - A. E. Housman, "The Oracles"

      Delete
    20. (((Thought Criminal)))June 28, 2022 at 7:44:00 PM CDT

      Ronald is pro-life except in cases where a fetus-stage human being is dismantled and snuffed out.

      Ronald's human life category has a height restriction. Kill them before they can get on the roller coaster.

      Delete
    21. TC, your conclusion of my take on abortion is a fabrication of your own invention.

      Delete
    22. Yes, Ron, we know. You are so open-minded that your brain fell out, and now you can't find it and put it back.

      Delete
    23. As for me, I seldom question the facts reported in the Lying New York Times or WaPo. I question the reporters motives and the thoroughness with which the facts have been addressed. I ask, "what is missing?" from this report. I don't refuse to even read it.

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    24. For the "truth" is Silent. It's the Oak @ Dodona.

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    25. You can choose to watch the oracle, listen to the sibyl, or hear the Priests interpretation of the sibyl's words. That's all on you.

      The Spartans on the sea-wet rock sat down and combed their hair.

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    26. ...as for me, I'll comb my hair.

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    27. Knowing that my way may not be laconic, yet I'm only one step away from the oracle's truth, and not two... like you.

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    28. ps - There's still plenty of seating available in Plato's Cave. Remember to book yours early and often. :)

      Delete
    29. Note to budding Lacanians (and select laconians). The sibyl if the Discourse of the Hysteric. The Priest's in the Discourse of the University. And mine... why the "Analyst's" discourse, of course. For the "Master's Discourse" is a democracy and the Master chases the "capitalists discourse? trying to divine the answer to satisfy us all, "Que Voui?"

      Delete
    30. ...next up on Cave TV, "how to build a fire" followed by "the tech of shadowboxes."

      Delete
    31. pps - There's method in ALL madness. What's yours? ;)

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    32. Addendum:

      Nietzsche, "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" (Prologue)

      When Zarathustra was thirty years old, he left his home and the lake of his home, and went into the mountains. There he enjoyed his spirit and solitude, and for ten years did not weary of it. But at last his heart changed,—and rising one morning with the rosy dawn, he went before the sun, and spake thus unto it:

      Thou great star! What would be thy happiness if thou hadst not those for whom thou shinest!

      For ten years hast thou climbed hither unto my cave: thou wouldst have wearied of thy light and of the journey, had it not been for me, mine eagle, and my serpent.

      But we awaited thee every morning, took from thee thine overflow and blessed thee for it.

      Lo! I am weary of my wisdom, like the bee that hath gathered too much honey; I need hands outstretched to take it.

      I would fain bestow and distribute, until the wise have once more become joyous in their folly, and the poor happy in their riches.

      Therefore must I descend into the deep: as thou doest in the evening, when thou goest behind the sea, and givest light also to the nether-world, thou exuberant star!

      Like thee must I GO DOWN, as men say, to whom I shall descend.

      Bless me, then, thou tranquil eye, that canst behold even the greatest happiness without envy!

      Bless the cup that is about to overflow, that the water may flow golden out of it, and carry everywhere the reflection of thy bliss!

      Lo! This cup is again going to empty itself, and Zarathustra is again going to be a man.

      Thus began Zarathustra’s down-going.

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    33. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 5:18:00 PM CDT

      TC, your conclusion of my take on abortion is a fabrication of your own invention.

      Is it? None of your prescriptions for fighting the fire include putting the fire out. The fire, in this analogy, has a "right" to burn, and burn your house, community, and nation down.

      So, if you truly are pro-life and opposed to abortion, where's your prescription to restrict and ban access to and the practice of abortion? Pay people to have, keep, and / or adopt children? With who's money? Yours?

      How are you opposed to an option you are more willing to attack those trying to close that option than the option itself? Why, as quarterback do you stare down the field at the most open opponent to throw the ball to?

      Delete
    34. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 5:28:00 PM CDT

      ...so yes, your "pro-life" position has a roller coaster height restriction. You would spare the little, defenseless, inexperienced ones the "hell" of your own ups and downs and loops and jostles by killing them at the amusement park gates. Cotton candy, after all, is too damned expensive.

      Delete
  6. I've always said SF that you cannot legistlate morality.

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    Replies
    1. I agree with that statement, Elizabeth. But, in true Talmudic fashion, I have to say that it is both true and false.

      In a democracy, the laws will reflect the morality of the people.

      Delete
    2. ...but not when it's established by 9 black robed men as it was with Roe and Lawrence v. Texas.

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    3. Farmer, agreed. That is why I agree with this latest decision to knock down Roe and send the question back to the people.

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    4. I agree with your statement SF as it is sound and based in morality of a people.

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    5. I can accept Lawrence in my state, Maryland, because Gay Marriage was on a referendum and was voted on and passed by the people of my State. I don't accept it anywhere else.

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    6. There's a simple answer to the abortion question. Put it on the ballot in your state.

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    7. ...and if you're still unsatisfied, put a "repeal" on the ballot in your State.

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    9. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 5:38:00 PM CDT

      Just end the tax deductions and other coded legal "benefits" of marriage. Why should two people married get a tax break that two single people making the same income but sharing their earned resources co-operatively do not get? The former is a government-ssnctioned business arrangement. The latter is a home.

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    10. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 5:45:00 PM CDT

      ...love may or may not be there in either... but love doesn't pay the bills.

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    11. I raised $750k worth of children on my "marriage. deduction". What a taxpayer rip-off, huh? People obviously aren't aborting kids for the tax deduction.

      Delete
    12. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 10:41:00 PM CDT

      But they are marrying and having / adopting kids for it. Why do you think gays want government-recognized marriage? Dual income, no kids, and a tax break...

      Delete
    13. ...and no risk exposure to AIDS and MPXV.

      Delete
    14. btw - The combined income is taxed at a higher bracket rate than the individual incomes merit. What a deal!

      Delete
  7. This list is indeed repugnant, but why is it presented here? Where does any part of it exist in reality? Has any group or politician presented any item on it as a serious proposal to be enacted into law? Any one person proposing any one of the items?

    As to the last question, I would say the answer is no. It argues between "what I want" and what religion dictates, both of which exist in the emotional part of the brain which cannot admit reason.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Every one of those items is in play at one level or another. Texas bounty hunts, for example.

      Where have you been?

      Delete
    2. Anonymous,
      It argues between "what I want" and what religion dictates, both of which exist in the emotional part of the brain which cannot admit reason.

      Mostly true -- although some Believers reason through doctrine to a great extent.

      Delete
    3. "what I want"

      What a Citizen wants can also very likely be what is a Right or liberty inherent in a free society. It's incumbent upon the State to show cause for why it should be curtailed or prohibited (i.e. harms, steals from or restricts the liberty of another Citizen).

      Delete
  8. Replies
    1. Excellent find. All good points. The coat hanger meme is especially egregious. Lefties are hooked on the 60's.

      Back then there was very little commercially available birth control, and it was often restricted, as were abortions.

      Interesting related note: When birth control and abortions were being debated in the late 60's, advocated claimed they would result in more marriage, less divorce and less out of wedlock births.

      Religious leaders, including Catholic priests and bishops and prominent Christian pastors warned they would result in exactly the opposite.

      Who was right?

      Will anyone on the left pause to even consider this?

      Delete
    2. SF,
      A little something to go along with the above....

      When I started dating in college in 1968, almost all of my dates assumed that I was on the pill because I had a college parking sticker on my car, and these octopuses so stated. I was expected to "put out" on first dates -- typically without so much as a first having a meal even at lowly McDonald's. I quit dating for a few years until I found someone who wasn't such a jerk.

      My best friend wasn't so lucky in 1971. One of her dates -- he worked for the U.S. Department of State -- beat her into submission when she informed him that she wasn't on the pill and wasn't going to "put out" on the first date. Yeah, she was brutally raped. Thank God that she wasn't pregnant.

      I wonder what dating like today for women attending college.

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    3. This is why "me too" was such a vital opportunity. I am hopeful that boys are now growing up with more realistic cultural expectations around dating etc.

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    4. Me too was the moment Fonzi jumped the shark of Feminism. And let's not pretend that all those "boys" aren't getting their cultural expectations from Porn Hub.

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    5. Like they get their fighting techniques and law enforcement expectations from the marvel cinematic universe...

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    6. No, the get those from Grand Theft Auto. The point is that the diegesis of the Marvel Universe isn't all that different from our own CNN produced version.

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    7. ...and they don't understand the difference until they're in police custody.

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    8. Down my way (speaking only for my social circle, not the UK as a whole) we enjoy action movies as entertainment, but find it pretty easy to spot their ethical shortcomings.

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    9. And how old are you? Were you as good at 15?

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    10. Early 40s, or "young" as I am determined to call it. I was a christian at 15, so many of our fellow commenters here would say I was better then.

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  9. My own close Jewish friends are outraged by the misconceptions about abortion and their faith. All tell me it's only liberal synagogues which don't come down HARD on killing unborn babies....sadly, they admit, most synagogues are liberal today and this is what Americans are mistakenly accepting. True Judaism is absolutely anti abortion....ever.

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    Replies
    1. Most commentary in the Talmud puts the life of the mother over the life of the. fetus, when the situation arises. Also, Leviticus (I think) as well as the Talmud does not go "eye for an eye" if someone strikes a woman and causes a miscarriage. The offender does not pay with his life, he must pay reparations to the father.

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  10. Excellent summary SF "If we want to end "X", we need to change those hearts and minds through scientific reasoning and moral persuasion, ...." Just fill in the X. This is true. It's also the way to end the drug epidemic - legal and illegal. It's EASIER if we start this work by age 2, then after libertine schools have twisted young minds.
    BAYSIDER

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  11. AOW, it is disgusting how much misinformation is out there and how many people will not research and self-educate. It seems they want to be spoon fed the garbage on the boob tube!

    Z, the Jews have suffered much misunderstand for years and centuries and the lies surround them are pure evil. The Jews are God's chosen people it is the Christians whom are grafted in (adopted in) and we should all stand with the Jewish people. Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.

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  12. The left is never really going to destroy this country. Why? Because they ALWAYS go too far. Moderate progressive concepts are invariably twisted into perversion and insanity. To sanction the murder of a child at the moment of birth is madness. It’s not a “choice,” it’s madness.

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  13. To those of you who are defending what the LGBTQ is doing as the “Protest”
    Making a complete MESS of the area that they are Parading at by throwing Garbage all over the place, I guess that they are incapable of policing themselves or criticizing one of their own. By the looks of how they are acting I would say that much of their "Protesting", "Activism",show the LACK of "education" they have, and that they are just wanting to display their uncivil ways in front of their Audience.
    .
    If they want to display that kind of VULGAR "entertainment", they can go to many of the Perverted Night Clubs they have for that kind of stuff.
    I went to the clean clubs......where it was booze, music, and dancing. And sometimes an all adult audience drag show.

    As I have stated may of times.............
    THERE ARE CHILD DECENCY LAWS IN EVERY SINGLE STATE IN THIS COUNTRY.
    WHY AREN/T THE POLICE ENFORCING THEM?

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  14. Tucker Carlson recently made a point which shines a light on a disgusting side of these "pro-choice" protestors:

    Many on the left now behave as if abortion is a positive good. Watch the video!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. And it certainly looks like insurrection!

      Delete
    2. Saul Alinsky, "Rules for Radicals"

      RULE 10: “If you push a negative hard enough, it will push through and become a positive.”

      Violence from the other side can win the public to your side because the public sympathizes with the underdog. (Unions used this tactic. Peaceful [albeit loud] demonstrations during the heyday of unions in the early to mid-20th Century incurred management’s wrath, often in the form of violence that eventually brought public sympathy to their side.)

      Delete
    3. btw - How do you brainwash a generation...?

      Delete
    4. ...and why can't "music" move on?

      Delete
    5. I saw that video earlier AOW and it disgusts me!

      Delete
    6. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 4:51:00 PM CDT

      What is the thing served in American government? What is the one thing all oaths of office and service pledge to protect and defend against all enemies foreign and domestic?

      Yep, you're right. It's the Constitution of the United States of America.

      So, define "insurrection" in that context. Which side is acting in defense of the Constitution, and which side is an enemy of the Constitution? One side? Both sides? Neither? Only the side protecting and defending the Constitution has the legal and moral high ground. Everyone ignoring it or subverting it or physically attacking those elected to serve, protect, and defend it are in fact "insurrectionists."

      My how that changes the championship brackets a bit.

      Delete
    7. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 6:27:00 PM CDT

      Hit bodyguards and grab the steering wheel. Throw your food. Show them all your last 14 days in power will not be spent being bound by a dusty piece of paper. You can shoot people on Fifth Avenue without consequence. You're a rock star, baby.

      Delete
    8. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 6:33:00 PM CDT

      ...so now we sit in a nation where 74 million people hated America and the Constitution enough to have actually voted for Trump....

      Delete
    9. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 6:41:00 PM CDT

      ...Mike Pence "lacked the courage" to violate the Constitution and break federal law. He deserves to be hung, right?

      Donald Trump was the worst President America will ever have. Edith Wilson doesn't even come close.

      Delete
    10. Oh really? Biden makes Trump look the best president the USA EVER HAD!

      Delete
    11. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 8:02:00 PM CDT

      Heh. Biden hasn't done anything, which would otherwise propel him to the top of government non-interventionist superhero-dom if not for his not doing anything includes not reversing the nosedive course Trump put us on.

      Delete
    12. ps- Is the war with Russia covered under the WoT anti-terrorist resolutions? Isn't CIA running it from Kyiv? How Constitutional is that?

      Delete
    13. (((Thought Criminal)))June 29, 2022 at 10:35:00 PM CDT

      As Constitutional as Edith Wilson's Palmer Raids, maybe more, as it's funded by Congressional approval.

      Don't mess with Biden's nap time. He gets cranky.

      Delete
    14. Congress funded a CIA Operations Center in Kyiv? Who knew?

      Delete
    15. @TC It was Biden who did that not Trump. Need you be reminded of the open border mess, Afghanistan, food supply shortages, baby formula missing from shelves, a VP who never went to the Southern Border, in fact, Biden did not either. REAL WINNERS here. In your dreams maybe ...

      Delete
  15. Abortion Over-reach? Probably. What happened when Congress bans certain weapons, sales skyrocket...

    from Ann Coulter: According to the pro-abortion Guttmacher Institute, 930,160 abortions are performed in the U.S. every year. The lion’s share of those abortions occur in states that Biden won. Sixty-eight percent of all abortions are performed in blue states and 32 percent in red states, according to the CDC.

    Far from restricting abortion, the blue states have begun wildly expanding abortion rights in response to Dobbs — to the extent that that’s humanly possible.


    Look for 1 million abortions next year, mostly "later term".

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    Replies
    1. +Also from Ann, this nugget...

      Also according to Guttmacher, 54 percent of all abortions already are “medication abortions,” i.e. accomplished with pills given within the first 10 weeks of pregnancy. Good luck trying to ban that: The combined power of federal law enforcement — the FBI, the DEA, Customs and Border Protection, and the U.S. military — plus state law enforcement can’t even keep fentanyl out of the country.

      Delete

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