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| Silverfiddle Rant! |
"...the United States stands on the cusp of surpassing 800,000 deaths from the virus..."
"Seventy-five percent of people who have died of the virus in the United States — or about 600,000 of the nearly 800,000 who have perished so far — have been 65 or older.
"Seventy-five percent of people who have died of the virus in the United States — or about 600,000 of the nearly 800,000 who have perished so far — have been 65 or older.
Thank you, New York Times for this excellent article. This brings home the fact that...
One in 100 older Americans has died from the virus.
That is a frightening crude mortality rate for that demographic: 1% of all people over 65. The Times adds...
For people younger than 65, that ratio is closer to 1 in 1,400.
That is a crude mortality rate of roughly 0.1% for those under 65. Data from the UK--where the government actually tracks and reports useful metrics--reports that for people under 65, around 70% of Covid deaths were people with pre-existing conditions. This is useful information our government should be collecting and reporting. That brings the death rate for the healthy under 65 population to down around 0.03%. When adjusted for time (a flu season is about 4 months), this makes Covid for that demographic three times deadlier than the 2019 flu season. *
For all people under 65, Covid is ten times as deadly as a more severe flu season, but that number is meaningless. We need stratification by age and preexisting conditions to make informed decisions.
For two years now, government and the Infotainment Media Complex has harassed and assaulted us with horrible, hysterical, and factually inaccurate reporting on Covid. Preening government camera hog Fauci hasn't helped matters, nor has the shrieking, blubbering mess of a bureaucrat Dr. Walensky. The New York Times article puts human faces on the numbers and puts the data into an understandable context.
By now, Covid-19 has become the third leading cause of death among Americans 65 and older, after heart disease and cancer. It is responsible for about 13 percent of all deaths in that age group since the beginning of 2020, more than diabetes, accidents, Alzheimer’s disease or dementia.
Government stupidly hounded, cajoled and propagandized working age people and children and adolescents, closing down schools and businesses, when it should have ditched the scary language and simply issued data-driven advice so people of all ages could make their own informed decisions.
Did government commit elder abuse by blaring alarums at the elderly--who are the demographic that has the highest trust in government--to "lockdown" and "self-quarantine" for going on two years now? Could government have done a better job informing them, so they could make their own risk/reward decisions?
Please go read the article. It has quotes and anecdotes from a broad spectrum of older folks. And before you go, please give this John Prine song a listen...
* NOTE: Back of the cocktail napkin calculations. I was too lazy to dump it all into a spreadsheet and get exact numbers, and showing my work would have made for some dry reading. Here's another comparison.
Don't deprive me of the maths, that's the best bit!
ReplyDeleteActually, regardless of how well executed the arithmetic, I would raise mostly the same points.
1. this is the number of people who died *given the outbreaks that actually happened*. If less counter-measures would have resulted in more serious outbreaks and more of them, those mortality numbers would be bigger obviously.
2. ordinary 'flu predominantly affects patients with comorbodities too.
3. Maybe it can work in other cultures, but being realistic about American and UK society it is obvious to me that had the government "issued data-driven advice so people of all ages could make their own informed decisions" we would have done nothing. We needed to be compelled to wear seatbelts in cars and stay sober behind the wheel, for goodness sake.
4. I would argue that lockdowns were longer and harder than they would have needed to be had they been applied earlier. It doesn't fit with the creeping totalitarian narrative, but IMO our governments (certainly the UK one) is characterised by covid denialism.
I'm in the awkward position of defending the necessity for government to wield emergency powers at a moment in history where are governments are least deserving of those powers. Don't think that I don't feel your arguments too. And don't expect me to defend every decision government has made, there have been many dreadful errors. I just think that you underestimate the damage covid could have caused had it been allowed to burn through the population. It's not theoretical: new york happened, lombardy happened. How many outbreaks on that scale are needed to qualify as an emergency?
Valid points all. I still think it's absurd me walking down the hall at work, all alone early in the morning, wearing a compulsory mask.
DeleteI also think what governments and the teachers unions have done to children in this nation is criminal, and that includes making them get the vaccine to go to school or enter public places.
HR called my boss (from home) and told him to tell me to call her immediately! It was an emergency!
DeleteSo I called my wife instead. She was fine.
So I called HR only to be asked if I had taken the shot.
So someone called off of work saying they tested positive and said they had had close contact with me without a mask.
And few wear a mask at work.
So I was told to go home for 5 days and then get tested to come back. So I told my boss, who she had not told.
He then asked me to tell her that WE had had close contact.
All my projects on hold.
Idiots.
Safetyism kabuki
DeleteEveryone just keeps on dancing...
DeleteAs someone starting to get over Covid after a good month-long wrasslin' match with it I can tell you I'm 51 and have no known comorbidities although heart disease and diabetes runs in my family. Covid *will* put you on your back. It's the second worse time I've ever been sick in my life. The most sick I've ever been was a flu that lingered for nearly 3 months that came with pneumonia and the works (diarrhea, hellish body aches, dehydration, kidney stones, painful rash, etc.). That said, I don't recommend getting Covid. From the literature I didn't tick every symptom box but the ones I did shut me the F down. Confusion from losing oxygen is the worst. I literally got lost on a two-way street a few blocks from my house. I don't know if it was new Christmas lights up on a usually pitch black dark country road but I might as well have been in Afghanistan. The terrain was totally alien to me. I don't want that feeling ever again. I slept nearly 2 days after that, after coughing up the Devil's doodoo and clearing my airways. Thankfully I was able to do that without hitting up a hospital. And this attack on my airways was not gradual. I was congested, but it went danger level all of a sudden and without warning. Scary shit. Flu-like symptoms my ass. That shit tried to suddenly kill me.
ReplyDeleteThat's what scares me the most about Covid. "Everything is a Covid symptom" and it doesn't seem to hit two people the same way. Now I'm reading about "long Covid," and wondering if I'm looking at another bout next year.
TC,
DeleteInteresting!
My brother-in-law, with several comorbidities (not obese at all), didn't have nearly as bad as time with COVID as you have had.
I'm not sure that there is a logical way to determine how severe or how mild a COVID case can be.
Of the dozen or so people including myself that have come down with Covid (5 have died, elderly with co-morbidities / compromised immune systems) absolutely none of them had the same opening symptoms. Some blew it off no sweat. Some caught pneumonia. Only myself and another got knocked down for a month with shifting symptoms. Loss of bowel control being one of the most humiliating.
DeleteI honestly don't think anyone knows what Covid does to the body, which symptoms anyone will have with any given infection. I got the kind that cramps your muscles into knots, makes you sleep for days, erases your ability to smell and taste and turns getting to the toilet before you crap yourself into a Herculean labor. Se breathing issues here and there. I know I didn't get the worst.
I'm glad you're on the mend. Thanks for the valuable insight.
DeleteAnother statistical form of bullshittery are "hospitalizations." What qualifies as a "hospitalization" to the bean counters? An ER visit that sends you home after a few hours? Being admitted for more than a day? Can anyone find a stat on how long the average Covid hospitalization lasts? Is this number shrink by simple hourly ER visits?
ReplyDeleteWho knows? Absolutely no one does. It's all bullshit.
I agree, but it is more meaningful than 'cases.'
DeleteA big question many smart scientific people are asking is, why are people who test positive sent home until they can't breathe and are on death's door, and then admitted to the hospital?
There is no course of treatment one can take at home at the onset?
And then there's the doctors who refuse positive swab tests and only want a PCR test before they'll treat you. I kinda understand the vetting there because swab tests are unreliable but real Covid infections avalanche fast. Like I mentioned earlier I went from a snotty congestion to brief near-paralysis of my diaphragm muscles without warning. There is a lot to be afraid of if you win the Covid lottery. Mostly that doctors don't have a clue what that lot is... If that attack on your respiratory muscles is only going to last a few minutes like me, or just snuff you out outright.
DeleteWell, I bought two tubes of apple flavored Ivermectin.
DeleteThat's a course you can take.
That's right Ed. Treatments DO exist, but don't make any money for big pharma.
DeleteAlso has anybody heard any TV doctors telling you to boost your immune system BEFORE you get sick? Me either.
How do you get the dosimetrics between a horse and a human with Ivermectin? I think I'd rather take my chances playing the neurodegeneration lottery (getting a mRNA vax) than mess with veterinary blood toxins.
DeleteBuilding your immune system and maintaining it is a good idea anyway. But it doesn't always work against Covid. I got it and I'm a fruit and nut eating fool.
DeleteAnd there are obviously meds experimental or otherwise. They had President Trump up and out of the hospital before his Medicaid ran out.
DeleteI wondered that myself.
DeleteIt turns out that the tube has a dispensing plunger that is "serrated". Each click during the plunge is for 50 pounds.
4 clicks, 200 pounds.
But do NOT get the Gold or Bronze.
DeleteThere is horse specific stuff added to those.
In my case, I had a substantial reaction to the J&J shot. All my doctors insisted and continue to insist that I not get an mRNA vaccine because of my history of reacting severely to live vaccines; the mRNA vaccine is "somewhat alive"' all that kidney trouble I had back in 2016 appears to have been precipitated by a live vaccine (chickenpox vaccine). "No more live vaccines for you," declared three doctors (primary care, neurologist, urologist).
ReplyDeleteWarren and I are mostly retired, so our exposure is minimal. Our primary care doc hasn't insisted that we get a booster shot. Yet, anyway.
I'm not masking up, but I am practicing social distancing. Social distancing and frequent hand-washing served me well over the years that I was in the classroom. I mostly avoided every virus going around.
I guess you could say I'm "anti-vax" but it isn't a real politic stance (but probably will be when the US becomes Australia with real jackboots and isolation camps).
ReplyDeleteMy concerns are the unknown long term effects of the vaccines (and vs. the long term effects of my having Covid already). The J&J vax messes with your cardiac muscles. People with heart disease shouldn't mess with that poison. The mRNA vaxs (Pfizer, Moderna) cause the body to attack itself looking for spike proteins, spike proteins that can cross the blood-brain barrier and really F you up. And just like over-sterilization has turned every hospital, clinic, surgery center and gym into staph-infection supermarkets and MRSA colonies, the Covid symptom-reducers (not vaccines) are doing the same... fast-tracking the development of variants that don't give a damn if you're "vaccinated" or not. I've read that "vaccinated" people exposed to the Omicron variant are 41+ times more likely to get Covid than "unvaccinated" people.
It's the Dunning-Kruger effect all the way down. Anyone that claims to know what to do to stop Covid-19 needs to be shot in the face for lying.
'I've read that "vaccinated" people exposed to the Omicron variant are 41+ times more likely to get Covid than "unvaccinated" people.'
DeleteWhere did you read that?
I'll have to find it. It was something about how Omicron is unfazed by antibodies created by the vaccines.
Deletehttps://www.statnews.com/2021/12/07/a-first-small-study-suggests-omicron-is-a-larger-threat-to-covid-19-immunity-than-other-variants/
DeleteThe Pfizer and Moderna "vaccines" are 41 times less effective at neutralizing the infectiousness / transmissibility of the Omicron variant than earlier variants like Delta.
If the Pfizer "vaccine" only rated a 90% effectiveness against Covid-19 (itself a dubiously high figure given "breakout" infection rates) then by the math, the Pfizer vaccine is only 2.2% effective vs. Omicron.
Are you going to keep dosing yourself with a vaccine that doesn't do jack shit?
Get the vax on an IV drip.
DeleteLol... A vax cyborg implant.
DeleteMore fun Omicron news.... The Omicron variant is 70 times more contagious than Delta, and vaccines are basically less than 3% effective against it.
Everyone is going to get Covid.
TC in other news there are NO confirmed deaths from Omicron at this time.
DeleteI don't think it is valid to combine the "41-fold reduction in neutralization [activity]" in vitro with the "90% effectiveness" outcome of a vaccine trial in that simplistic way. They are different types of quantity, it's like dividing a mass in kg by a calendar date.
DeleteFor many reasons, 41 times less neutralization activity in a test tube does not correspond to "41+ times more likely to get [infected] than unvaccinated people."
@EastBayLarry, British newspapers were reporting the first omicron-related death over here about a week ago.
EaatBayLarry,
DeleteCovid also causes lung damage and a lifetime of other *milder than outright killing you" effects.
For many reasons, 41 times less neutralization activity in a test tube does not correspond to "41+ times more likely to get [infected] than unvaccinated people."
DeleteNeutralization is neutralization. If a Covid-19 vaccine is 41 times less effective at neutralizing Covid-19 Omicron variant in a test tube, there's nothing magical going to happen when you inject that ineffective vaccine into someone. If the vaccine is 41 times less effective against Omicron, the vaccine that is 90% effective against Alpha / Delta is only 2.2% effective against Omicron.
People that think they are safe because they're vaccinated are woefully mistaken when it comes to Omicron.
And yet, to this day, China has not had the price exacted on it for doing this to us.
DeleteWith Fauci's help.
No. We don't know how activity maps onto effectiveness. A remedy that is twice as strong is not necessarily twice as effective. For example, imagine a vaccine that was twice as active in vitro than the current offerings. Is it 180% effective? Is there some law of biochemistry preventing a vaccine from stimulating more that 11% more antibody activity (by your maths, that should make it 100% effective) than the current one against previous variants?
DeleteWe do know that the vaccine hasn't changed while the disease has.
DeleteThereby, we can measure the effectiveness of the extant vaccines vs. each new variant. We know also that the effectiveness is not the same vs. each variant, and also that the effectiveness of the extant vaccines vs. each variant is decaying over time (thus the call for booster doses). The effectiveness of the Pfizer vaccine vs. the Delta variant drops 10% from 90% to 80% after 6 months and continues to free fall from there without a booster. Booster after booster after booster multiplies the risk of long term damage from largely empirically unknown side effects. We now have a variant (Omicron) that virtually ignores the "protections" touted against other variants. There are several other variants (Mu, for example) that scientists are having difficulty even mapping the genome of. By the math given, the current same-vaccine-for-rapidly-mutating-virus strategy is a hard fail. The extant vaccine vs. Omicron is less than 3% effective. We know Omicron *actively* mutates its spike proteins. They're not the same spike proteins current mRNA vaccines induce antibody production for. And, the way Omicron mutates its spike proteins, it's probably going to continue to bypass current vaccine capabilities to target spike proteins with each new generation of mutations in the spike proteins. So, we have a rapidly evolving, highly contagious virus variant for which all we have is exploring the option of overdosing on a dubiously effective vaccine, while we've got coming down the pike Mu and the other variants that we can't even map the genetics of yet.
We've had this problem and this solution before. We bombed the shit out of swamps with DDT to kill mosquitoes to stop malaria.
What kind of bomb do we use on cities to get rid of human Covid carriers?
We stopped using DDT because of long term side effects in humans...
DeleteA less potent version of a remedy could plausibly be completely ineffective, as effective as the original, or anything in between. I think there may be exciting cases where less potency might increase the effectiveness, because biology is complicated.
DeleteTop tip: if you stop repeating the same basic error over and over, I'll respect you more.
You seem to be operating from the dubious assumption that your respect is worth something.
DeleteThat you can't figure out that a vaccine that is (allegedly) 90% effective at neutralizing the Alpha / Delta variants and 41 times less effective at neutralizing Omicron is (90 / 41) only 2.2% effective is probably you should take up with a remedial math tutor.
Meanwhile maybe you can find the crayon that figures out why Omicron is the new "breakthrough" infection while everyone else already knows.
Not just my respect, the respect of anyone who is capable of simultaneously holding in their head not just two numbers, but also what those two numbers mean.
DeleteAnd what does the effectiveness of a vaccine vs. a certain variant and the effectiveness of the same vaccine being 41 times less than that vs. a different variant mean?
DeleteIs English comprehension for you as bad as your math skills?
Top tip: don't feign intellect around the real thing.
Refer back to the study (which in any case is "small and preliminary", don't forget) and try not to be too embarrased when you notice that the thing they are measuring is not "effectiveness". The "41-fold decrease" is in FRNT50, the (inverse of) plasma dilution required to reduce the number of infection foci by 50%.
DeleteWhat effect is the vaccine supposed to have? Reducing the number of infection foci, right? Creating antibodies to... The vaccine is doing that 41 times less vs. Omicron? Earth to Poindexter...
DeleteJesus is this thing on?
I'm terribly sorry, I was labouring under the misapprehension that you couldn't possibly be this stupid. Please, carry on.
DeleteMeanwhile nearly 80% of Omicron cases were vaccinated and a third of those with boosters.
DeleteLet's keep throwing a vaccine shown in labs to be less than 3% effective at it.
Hey, Fauci is getting UNLIMITED RESEARCH FUNDING... and at this unlimited funding rate, we should have a cure for the common cold with his wet-dreamed "universal vaccine" in about a hundred years.
DeleteOf course, by then the rest of the human immune system will have been so genetically altered as to render it completely ineffective and our species driven to self-extinction.
DeleteI was 77 when I was infected and made sick by the corona virus. Have been hospitalized three times in four years for pneumonia, each time for two weeks or more. Severe emphysema with 40%+ destruction of both lungs. One heart attack and several strokes. Parkinson's Disease since 2006. People like me have no chance when Covid strikes. It kills us.
ReplyDeleteMe not so much. Fever of 104.4, which is beyond miserable. Loss of taste and smell, dry cough and a rattle in my lungs. A double course of Zithromax cleared that up. Doctor's office, no hospital. I don't recommend it, but I see no reason to close the economy to prevent it.
And that's basically what we are doing now. The risk of death, other than those so elderly that they are basically housebound by their age, is so low that we are shutting down our social contact to prevent a survivable illness. That represents a level of cowardice that I find astonishing in a nation that endlessly threatens war against other nations.
My fever hit 105.2. I know that hell well
DeleteAnyone who is at risk and/or over 65 needs to face the facts that no matter how they cut it, they are the ones at high risk of death. We had 28 deaths here in my retirement community. Last April 96 percent of the residents got the 2nd vax. We have had no further deaths. A handful of cases since though unsure if they were vaxed or not.
ReplyDeleteHowever, 0ver 400 of the staff have had Covid unbelievably. Yet we have remained relatively unaffected.
This new variant is the new game in town.The local hospitals are just about full. I follow the stats and gives some insight.
https://www.lancastergeneralhealth.org/covid-19-information/covid-19-data-for-lancaster-county
When Omicron hits America, it's going to hit the "vaccinated" community hard, as hard as if not harder than the unvaccinated community because the vaxxed have been fed a trough of bullshit about how they're "safe."
DeleteThe wheels will come off calls for vaccine mandates when the Omicron variant of Covid is hospitalizing the "vaccinated" just as fast as the unvaccinated.
Well considering over 200 residents have had it here and 28 dead and 400 staff have had it not much choice. You don't know.
DeleteThis Covid stuff is getting evangelistic overtones of righteousness.... indignation that hell is about to descend and I for one am sick of it.
I offered this an anecdotal experience.
Early signs from Southern Africa indicate Omicron may be highly contagious but not nearly as severe as even the original. If that is true, it would be a blessing better than a vaccine.
DeleteIsn't the "promise" of the current "vaccines" that if (or rather when) you catch Covid that it will be less severe than if you remained "unvaccinated?"
DeleteSo vaxxed people will get the Omicron variant, but "it won't be so bad.'
Hogwash.
SF.. that is my hope and the way these bugs usually go as I understand. Probably in the end almost all of us will get a case of it of some sort. My hope if we can stave off the exposure until the government gets out of the way we will have adequate therapies to support patients with the disease. There is no excuse by now not to be able to have home testing kits for everyone that is reliable. Then monoclonal antibodies as the state of Florida is making available.
DeleteDifficult to extrapolate from SA's much more youthful population.
DeleteI watched NBC News this evening and the contradictions were staggering. Fauci tells us the vaccine plus booster is working fine and will protect against the new Omicron variant, but everything else in the same news report contradicts every part of his statement.
ReplyDeleteMore people have dies of Covid this year, with vaccines available, than did last year before the vaccine was introduced.
The NFL Cleveland Browns, who are 95% vaccinated, have no fewer than 7 team members on the disabled list because they tested positive for Covid.
Many states require masking in public venues even if vaccinated, which says the government believes that the vaccine does not work, or at least does not work very well.
Government messaging led by Doctator Fauci has been a ball of confusion, contradictions and dictatorial mandates.
DeleteThe massive missteps, misinformation, and incompetence of the COVID response was a product of Doctator Fauci?
DeleteNo, don’t think so. I’m pretty sure that would have been higher gov officials. Fauci irked the top man who was telling us it would go away in just a few days. Of course we all know when that top man gets pissed at someone, all he has to do is point his finger and the basket of gullibles start barking.
I’m not sure what precautions you’d deem acceptable while NY was hauling dead bodies out of nursing homes and renting ice cream semi-trailers for morgues or while hospitals were converting parking buildings to makeshift ICUs because you never say, or that number was insignificant in the “COVID by numbers” percentages.
One has to wonder what % of death would justify what level of corrective or proactive measure.
You're going to get Omicron
Deletehttps://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/coronavirus/weve-never-seen-this-before-in-nyc-covid-positivity-rate-doubles-in-3-days-as-omicron-spreads/3454450/?amp
"This is SARSCoV2 evading both vaccine & virus induced immunity *against infection* unlike any variant before.
DeleteThis is Omicron saying "F your vaccination"
Ronald, One common sense precaution would have been to not put sick people in nursing homes. Sensible states took that precaution without any nudges from preening prick Fauci
DeleteTo respond to that single cherry picked variable that dodges the entire argument, how precisely does one not put or allow sick people in nursing homes without infringing on all those freedumbs the pro-COVID crowd so adamantly demand?
DeleteWhat does it take to put an isolation ward into a nursing care facility? Plexiglass doors, some screws, a little elbow grease and willpower? Maybe a dab of common sense about keeping the infected away from the vulnerable?
DeleteYeah TC, a few screws and a beautiful plexiglass door along with a shot of Clorox would have ended it all in 2 weeks.
DeleteTC,
DeleteYou're going to get Omicron.
I think so. As stated in the news link you left:
This is #SARSCoV2 evading both vaccine & virus induced immunity *against infection* unlike any variant before.
There's nowhere to run, nowhere to hide. Best bet: social distancing and frequent washing of hands. Masks, at best, are nearly ineffective.
Hopefully, herd immunity for Omnicron will come into play and stop the virus from spreading.
Yeah TC, a few screws and a beautiful plexiglass door along with a shot of Clorox would have ended it all in 2 weeks
DeleteMaybe this is too advanced for the side of the science aisle that would have Joe Biden be the first female President if he claimed he felt certain things, but what about keeping the infected away from the vulnerable did these nursing homes not understand?
I think the difficulty arose from the large number of patients involved.
DeleteI just got over omicron. This was round two and it was a walk in the park and I have risk factors. I also had two moderna shots
ReplyDelete1) Never panic
2) hydate
3) sit outside in a safe place
4) keep moving
Omicron is super contagious but is almost s blessing in disguise. If you are vaccinated you should be fine.
Well, as I stated above, I was in contact and got sent home. Since then I started a irritated throat and lethargy. Then I woke in a sweat and felt better yesterday, then I got a really sore throat last night, took some nyquil and woke up in sweat soaked sheets. Changed my t-shirt and fell back asleep until ten am today. So far, so good.
DeleteNever lost appetite or smell.
Could have been garden variety respiratory infection, you know, like people used to get.
Wowzer!
ReplyDelete‘Toxic spike proteins’ made by COVID jabs ‘often cause permanent damage’ in kids: mRNA inventor
Excerpt:
The first is that a viral gene will be injected into your children’s cells. This gene forces your child’s body to make toxic spike proteins. These proteins often cause permanent damage in children’s critical organs, including:
Their brain and nervous system.
Their heart and blood vessels, including blood clots.
Their reproductive system.
And most importantly, this vaccine can trigger fundamental changes to their immune system.
The most alarming point about this is that once these damages have occurred, they are irreparable.....
I know I'm a broken record, but I'll keep saying it: it is criminal to force children to get this vaccine. If parents have a child who has some kind of a condition, I respect their decision either way, government is criminally insane by pushing this vaccine on people 18 and younger
DeleteIt's like everything we know about epigenetic change as a person ages is being ignored for the "bomb it all with DDT" strategy.
Delete"We just need moar poison and earlier!"
SF, the CDC and FDA have deemed the vax safe for children. From actual data before our own eyes, we now know vaccinations have saved lives with a near zero adverse side effects.
DeleteI do realized that the modern day mindset of the indoctrinated right is to bash and discredit government institutions and professionals but what credentials do you hold or what logical rebuttal do have that disqualifies their recommendations?
SF,
DeleteJust watch. Public schools will require that all students be vaccinated, K-graduate school.
I also expect that Medicare will coerce us seniors to be vaxxed and boosted. I should have a medical exemption (as I've explained several times), but the federal bureaucracy and the SCOTUS will coerce us.
COVID hysteria these days. Big time.
RJW,
DeleteFrom actual data before our own eyes, we now know vaccinations have saved lives with a near zero adverse side effects.
We have no longitudinal studies to bear out that assertion.
AOW, while we certainly can’t see the future, we can look back from the last year and reasonably deduce that vaccinations saved lives during the Delta wave as it was predominantly the unvaxxed dying.
DeleteWe can also look back at the polio era as a lesson. We didn’t know what was in that vax either and surely we can agree that science and medicine has significantly advanced since.
That lesson would be cautionary.
DeleteThe ideal (plenty of time to test new vaccines without suffering more waves of covid infections) is not available, so you have to choose the least bad option.
A total of 771 children under 18 have died thus far from Covid in the USA. Japanese studies say that vaccines create a x7 death risk over disease. The answer is obvious. DO NOT VACCINATE UNDER 18's
Delete"SF, the CDC and FDA have deemed the vax safe for children."
DeleteThalidomide anyone?
Ed, how bout them Smallpox and Polio vaxs? A mistake?
DeleteJoe, I think we’ve kicked that Japanese can before. Nothing has changed since other than more dead. You’re still ignoring the reality that those vaccinated are less likely to contract the virus which would reduce the spread.
Really Ron, because today the CDC Revealed that in the US, 79% of Omicron Patients Were "Fully Vaccinated", 32% Had Booster Shots.
Delete:P
DeleteSo get your vaccination amulet/totem and satisy your vaccine fetish if you want to, Ron, but leave the rest of the sane world out of your magical covid prevention fantasy.
DeleteMe, I'm taking my kids to an Omicron exposure party so that they'll get the Covid early when their immune systems are healthy and can fight it off and gain lifelong immunity, instead of missing a monthly vaccination appointment in the year 2093 when they have all kinds of comorbidities and dying from your Covid fantasy "safety dance"..
DeleteAccording to one analyses of vaccination deaths for children under 18... So we have 1,312 deaths that are highly likely to be caused by the vaccine compared to 757 deaths from COVID.
DeleteI'm not opposed to all vacs.
DeleteJust these untested nouveau-science experiments being performed on mandated lab rats. With disastrous results.
Some governments are starting to restrict their usage because of the myocarditis issues, and now cancer.
Ed, I too would be opposed to vaccines under those conditions but that isn't the case here.
DeleteCut and pasted from an AARP article debunking the myths of Fox News and the pro-COVID propaganda machine:
It’s true that the COVID-19 vaccines arrived in record time, but the steps that were hurried “were essentially the paperwork,” Andrew Bradley, M.D., a vaccine expert and professor at Mayo Clinic, explained in a recent media briefing.
All three available vaccines in the U.S. — from Pfizer-BioNTech, Moderna and Johnson & Johnson — were tested in tens of thousands of people in clinical trials and rigorously evaluated for their safety and effectiveness.
Scientists had a bit of a leg-up from the beginning, which helped to accelerate the process. The virus that causes COVID-19 is related to other coronaviruses that have been under the microscope for years, including those that cause severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) and Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS). “The knowledge gained through past research on coronavirus vaccines helped to accelerate the initial development of the current COVID-19 vaccines,” the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) says.
Investing in early manufacturing and distribution also got shots in arms faster than usual.
RJW,
DeleteYour ability to ignore the elephant in the room to validate your... whatever the hell they/it is.
One question; What are the long term effects? There wasn't enough time taken to have any idea. Not even a year out! You have to have some kind of idea that these aren't traditional vaccines, not at all, and if you realize that what they are telling you isn't true, these "vaccines" are little more than prophylactics.
Warren, considering you answered your own "one question" to me, that leaves me somewhat at a disadvantage as now I have to convince you of what you adamantly defend.
DeleteI'm not sure what elephants you're seeing or saw but I'm seeing pushing a million dead here at home and saw the Delta virus predominately filling ICUs and graveyards with the unvaccinated. Being an old schooled poker player, to me, my options are clear albeit long term circumstances might prove me wrong.
And for the record, I have never endorsed mandatory vaxing, passports, shutdowns, or so on. My concerns have been more towards the motives of a certain faction doing all they can to discourage common sense practices.
Your reading comprehension skills are non-existent.
DeleteIt's not a vaccine, it's MNRA tech which hasn't been tested for long term effects.
Yes, I answered the question I asked, you know, right after the question mark.
I guess I'm going to have to assume you agree with me and you're just rambling on with some kind of stream of consciousness BS.
Let me attempt to explain this to you one more time; this "vaccine" has not been fully tested!
Ever hear of Thalidomide babies? Did you know that countless children were given Phenobarbital and as a result many have a measurable lowered IQ. Doesn't any of this concern you?
Warren, I have no control of what you assume.
DeleteDo I know the long term effects? No. Does anyone? Probably not. Are there historical and/or present errors in medicine? Yes.
But again, I have to consider not only the success of the polio and small vaxs, MMR, Tdap, HPV, et al but also the success so far of the COVID vax. This was proven in the Delta wave as well as more fatalities in strong Trump voting districts where the vaccinated are fewer.
And I also have to consider in my decision to now having the booster shot without positively knowing the long term effects is that it wasn't thrown together overnight as some want us to believe but rather has been studied for years as it relates to SARS and MERS.
And finally in determining my decision, I had to decide on who I trusted. Was it my doctor and pretty much the entire world wide medical profession and scientists or did I trust the propaganda right wing media that told us Iraq attacked us on 9/11 and that the Affordable Care Act had some Gestapo squad that was going to round up the elderly to bring before a "death panel" to plead their case for survival?
And considering the likes of Carson, Newsmax, Epochtimes, etc have been a boiling pot of misinformation from the beginning, my decision was cut and dry, even if I don't know 100% of the long term effects.
@RJW
Delete"I don't know 100% of the long term effects."
The point is that you assume that you know 'any' of the long term effects as they are unknowable as NO LONG TERM STUDIES HAVE BEEN DONE!.
Blah blah blah blah, If it isn't "right wing media", it's you obsession with Trump. Care to have a look at the absolutely bullshit coverage given to the totally bogus "Trump Dossier"? How about the bunch of perverts being rousted from CNN now that they have come under the scrutiny of the general public?
I think we are done, here. I don't really care to hear you babble on.
"Do I know the long term effects? No. Does anyone? Probably not."
Delete---Ronald J. Ward December 19, 2021 at 8:29:00 AM CST
RJW, the polio era was interesting. We didn't have those longitudinal studies back then either. But people, desperate for something to save lives, lined up everywhere for that vaccine. And then, as AOW predicts will happen now, governments across the US mandated the polio vax to enter school.
ReplyDeleteLook, I'm thrice vaxxed. I had a breakthrough Delta case, in Mexico. I got lost of friends on both sides of the issue. This is a mess for our society.
It's as if we want to disagree. Violently.
I know the US government in the past, has imposed rationing, emergency orders, limited movement, etc on the American people. Think WWII. I know my parents didn't like their cup of sugar a week or the gas rationing. All of that was tough. But we accepted it, for the good of what we though was all of America.
What has changed that there is such a visceral reaction now? A national emergency was declared by President Trump. No one complained when he signed that. Under that declaration, the president, who ever it is, has extraordinary powers.
Get vaxxed, don't get vaxxed. But if you're not, just be ready to accept some restrictions. Until we get through this...
Dave, We’re a long way from the Roosevelt and Eisenhower days.I’m firmly convinced today’s division is intentionally stoked and fanned. For political reasons. I once said that Mitch McConnell would watch the country burn to the ground before letting a Democrat have credit for putting the fire out. Today I think he’s an accomplice in lighting the fire.
DeleteSince 79% of US Omicron patients were "fully vaccinated" and 32% of those had gotten their "booster shots", what restrictions should we be putting on the "fully vaccinated" to stop the spread?
Delete....Cuz if you want the unvaxxed to accept being restricted, surely the vaccinated must similarly accept restrictions.
DeleteWhat happens when the supply of chemicals needed in PCR tests can't keep up with demand? Because that logistics train is already 3 to 5 days long and stretched threadbare. Pray for longer Covid incubation times?
Delete"We're going to test you for the new variant when we get the chemicals in a few days. After we get through the backlog we'll have your results in another few days. But, the good news is we'll know you have the new variant by the time you're drowning in snot on our doorstep later this week."
Delete"Oh no, we need a positive PCR test before we can see you."
Delete+1
DeleteReminds me of the checkout girl at w grocery store in Georgia that got her head blown off for refusing to ring up a guy that "wasn't wearing his mask correctly."
DeleteThe first fascist to fall.
If you thought that your vaccinations would protect you, think again. The Omicron variant is exponentially doubling every day... that shouldn't be happening if vaccinations had any real effect.
ReplyDeleteAs of Saturday morning, there were 830 cases of Omicron confirmed by DNA sequencing across the country, a 97 percent increase from Friday morning’s tally (this means it is exponentially doubling every day).
In reality, the true number of Omicron cases is much higher, as only 1 to 2 percent of all cases are sequenced for variant markers.