Stoning of the Devil or stoning of the jamarāt (Arabic: رمي الجمرات) is part of the annual Islamic Hajj pilgrimage to the holy city of Mecca in Saudi Arabia. Muslim pilgrims fling pebbles at three walls, called jamarāt, in the city of Mina just east of Mecca. It is one of a series of ritual acts that must be performed in the Hajj.Read the rest HERE.
On the 10th day of Dhu al-Hijjah (Eid al-Adha), pilgrims must strike only one of the large jamrah with seven pebbles. After the stoning is completed on the day of Eid, every pilgrim must cut or shave their hair. On each of the following two days, they must hit each of the three walls with seven pebbles, going in order from east to west. Thus at least 49 pebbles are needed for the ritual, more if some throws miss. Some pilgrims stay at Mina for an additional day, in which case they must again stone each wall seven times makes 70 pebbles. The pebbles used in the stoning are traditionally gathered at Muzdalifah, a plain southeast of Mina, on the night before the first throwing, but can also be collected at Mina....
Also consider THIS:
Ṭawāf (طواف) is one of the Islamic rituals of pilgrimage. During the Hajj and Umrah, Muslims are to circumambulate the Kaaba (most sacred site in Islam) seven times, in a counterclockwise direction. The circling is believed to demonstrate the unity of the believers in the worship of the One God, as they move in harmony together around the Kaaba, while supplicating to God....Read the rest HERE.
So, I ask the question: Is Islam a form of paganism?
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ReplyDeleteThe question is simple. Being that Islam demands the imposition of Sharia Law, which demands supremacy over all/any other law (including the US Constitution), shouldn't it be banned ? Instead of 1800 (or however many there are) mosques in the US, shouldn't there be none, with all mosques converted into homeless shelters or buildings providing some kind of needed social service ?
ReplyDeleteAnd Islamic theology has some of its roots in various pagan beliefs. so yes, it is a form of Paganism and should not be allowed in America along with the Muslim Brotherhood and other organizations like CAIR, ISNA, MSA, MAS, et al of their jihadist ilk, be shut down as the subversive traitors that they are ?
Islam is a dangerous cult!
ReplyDeleteI don't see a connection to paganism.
ReplyDeleteThe connection of Christmas to paganism is a great deal more apparent.
Ducky-There used to be kaa'bas all over the saudi peninsula. mohammed razed all but the one in Mecca. In EACH AND EVERY kaa'ba, there are nitches for each tribal god or goddess...mohammed destroyed ALL IDOLS..EXCEPT for his tribe's.
ReplyDeleteDo you know what that idol was? It IS a statue of Semiramis(Nimrod's queen) and Tammuz...the moon god. It is a Pieta style statue...oh, by the way, mohammed, in an effort to gain support from 2 tribes, left thier 2 goddess statues and declared them to be allah's daughters...hmmmmm, sounds like paganism to me.
By the way, they also believe that the Jews and the Christians CHANGED THE BIBLE and rendered it invalid. And they teach that Jesus didn't really die, that HE is subordinate to mohammed.
In other words, it is a conglomerate of bad interpretation, disinformation and shocking cruelty.
I've read it, have you?
tmw
Yes, the kaaba became a shrine dedicated to the worship of the one true God.
DeleteEarly on even some Christians performed haj.
Of course the early Israelites, a minor tribe in Canaan used religion in the same way Muhammad used it to consolidate power.
I know for a fact that Protestants do not use the same bible that I use as a Roman Catholic, what's your point?
I still don't see what stoning the devil has to do with pagan beliefs. You seem to be a protestant and might well believe in a true physical Lucifer.
so I ask the question again.
Next thing you know you'll claim that Christianity is an extension of Judaism alone and not also an amalgam of Greco-Roman culture.
You make no sense.
@ Ducky
DeleteTMW makes no sense to you because if you have a foundation in Catholic faith, it is fractured. You act as if the faith of Catholics is different from that of Protestants, and while there are minor differences, they are not substantial.
What you know for a fact could easily fit into a thimble with much room left over for your tendency of half-truth and talking point. There is no difference between Catholic and Protestant Bibles in the New Testament. The only differences in the Old Testament are in their organization. Catholic Bibles maintain the Septuagint, while after the Reformation, Christian Bibles reflect a reorganization of Jewish canon into the Apocrypha. Today, these works are known as the deuterocanonical books.
The lesson here is that you can avoid having everyone (and I do mean everyone) think of you as a stooge if you conversed with people, rather than trying to impress them with what you think you know … which, as I said, isn’t much.
All religions employ "ritual". How is this a "pagan" ritual in some way different from an exocism?
ReplyDeleteIf you ask me, there's a one-for-one correspondence between this ritual reconstructing the "temptations" of Abraham with the three temptations of Christ in the desert.
ReplyDelete...the only real difference lies in the "state" in which Highway 61 lies. ;)
ReplyDelete"So, I ask the question: Is Islam a form of paganism?"
ReplyDeleteI guess that's open to endless debate. According to dictionary definition it isn't. That being said, however, as a body that purports to be a religion, a significant component of it's followers are a major threat to Christians and Jews, Worldwide! Their stealth, unpredictability and general lack of contrition for barbaric acts, committed in the name of Allah, should be met with suspicion by all of a different ilk. While they may not [all] pose a danger, it seems impossible to predict which ones do.
I don't think you will find many people who think that Islam is a form of paganism, even if some of the rituals seem odd. On the other hand, if one finds the stoning of women, cutting off of heads, blowing up innocents, murdering one's own children, and performing Clitoridectomy a form of barbarism, then I think you could make a good argument about Islam and Paganism.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI know quite a few evangelical Christians who strongly maintain that Buddhism, Hinduism, Taoism, Confucianism, etc., are pagan religions. These same people balk when it comes to labeling Islam as paganism. Why? Because Islam is monotheistic?
ReplyDeleteYes, it is not pagan because it is Abrahamic; also it is not related in anyway to the historic polytheisms which Christianity displaced. That deals with the two most common ways of defining "pagan".
DeleteThe specifics of these rituals don't enter into it. I've witnessed christian ceremonies involving circling around alters, lots of candle lighting etc. If you didn't know it was Christian, it would look like the Occult.
Jez,
DeleteCould you elaborate on your assertion that Islam is Abrahamic?
You said:
it is not related in anyway to the historic polytheisms which Christianity displaced.
Islam appeared some 600 years after Christianity. So, is Islam trying to displace Christianity?
It is true that paganism is associated with polytheisms. However, some comments above indicate that Islam is closely related to polytheism -- particularly with regard to the origin of Allah. From this source:
...The Arabs had tribal gods in which they worshipped. Every tribe had their own God. "The Quraysh tribe into which Muhammad was born was particularly devoted to ALLAH..."
More at the above link.
Antigenic just means stemming from the ot figure of Abraham. I'm sure Islam and Xianity each contain mythological elements that appealed to the polytheistic populations they ended up converting. Also, I think both religions encourage proselytism.
DeleteProselytism via persuasion is one think. Cutting off the heads of those who refuse to be proselytized is another. To my knowledge. Christians today aren't cutting off the heads of those who don't profess Christianity.
DeleteThe tenets of Islam change the personage of Abraham into someone that doesn't comply with what is presented in the Bible.
For example, the Bible teaches that Abraham was told to sacrifice his son Isaac, whom God spared at the last moment as a symbol of the coming Messiah and of God's chosen people. The Koran teaches that Abraham was told to sacrifice Ishmael, who then becomes a powerful symbol of Allah's chosen people.
Also, the Bible teaches that Jehovah called Abraham. The Koran teaches that Allah called Abraham. Jehovah and Allah are not the same.
You said:
I'm sure Islam and Xianity each contain mythological elements that appealed to the polytheistic populations they ended up converting.
I say: As a Christian, I do not believe that Christianity contains mythological elements -- a matter of faith for me. That said, it is usual for any faith to try to use common points to make connections with others who are not yet subscribers to that particular faith.
Um. Typo alert: "think" should read "thing."
DeleteI strongly disapprove of decapitations, religiously motivated or otherwise.
DeleteThe Muslims use a different name, but it's supposed to be the same god -- He's the One God, he's the Creator, he appears in the same stories (eg. Abraham commanded to slay his son -- the particular son is unnamed in the Qu'ran). Put it this way: if it were fiction and they were supposed to be original characters, there would be a case for plagiarism!
I strongly disapprove of decapitations, religiously motivated or otherwise.
DeleteThe Muslims use a different name, but it's supposed to be the same god -- He's the One God, he's the Creator, he appears in the same stories (eg. Abraham commanded to slay his son -- the particular son is unnamed in the Qu'ran). Put it this way: if it were fiction and they were supposed to be original characters, there would be a case for plagiarism!
Ducky-Check out Isaiah 9...it speaks of the coming, "Son of David", who's name just happens to be(trumpets and drum roll, please), EMMANUEL, "GOD with us". Then there is Paul's digression in Romans(9-12) about how Christians are grafted into the Jewish system of belief in JEHOVAH.
ReplyDeleteSo, yes, Christianity is a sect, if you will, of Judaism. And many of the early Christians were of the Jewish priesthood. Did they know something?
All the first apostles were Jews, the 4 Evangelists were 3 Jews and a Greek.
As Paul stated in Romans, "...to the Jew first, then the gentile." Of the 33 books of the NT, 31 were written by Jews. In the OT, the prophets and the psalmists looked forward to and longed for the day that Messiah would come. Including Abraham...and he was on Mount Zion, with Isaac, and saw the LAMB OF GOD when he was told by GOD not to sacrifice his son.
As for paganism vs. polytheism, if you are worshipping a single "no-god", you are a pagan. Look at Mithridates, that was a single, "no-god", satanists worship Lucifer, a fallen angel, he too is a "no-god".
The Bible makes it very clear, if you do not worship JEHOVAH, you are a pagan.
I ain't arguing with HIM!
tmw